this post was submitted on 20 Jan 2025
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This was originally posted as a comment response in !asklemmy@lemmy.world.

Back in December, the instance hosting 196 (lemmy.blahaj.zone) announced that, as part of its mission as a trans-friendly space, harassment based on gender or neopronouns would remain** prohibited—even if the user in question was suspected of being a troll. Users were asked to disengage, block, and report suspected trolling behavior rather than bring harassment into a community already vulnerable to that kind of bullying.

There was a small backlash to the policy from some users. This led to a number of “toe the line” posts that weren’t outright gender-based harassment but strongly signaled an intent to misgender or harass in the future. Blahaj admins promptly removed all offending comments during this wave of dissent.

Important to note: The majority of the Blahaj and 196 users supported the policy, upvoting and praising the admins for creating a safe space for trans individuals.

By January, the backlash had mostly subsided, and the trolls causing issues had moved on. While the 196 moderators, including @moss and their team, did agree with the specific neopronouns policy, they remained unhappy with the broader policy of respect for trans identities. They cited “personal differences” and expressed discontent with instances where Blahaj admins directly removed comments which harassed or openly expressed intent to harass trans identities, feeling that it overstepped their role.*

Yesterday, @moss and the 196 moderation team enacted a major decision without consulting the community. They locked !196@lemmy.blahaj.zone and instructed users to move to !196@lemmy.world.

This move was extremely unpopular. Many users strongly dislike lemmy.world for various reasons (a complicated topic better unpacked elsewhere). The announcement post was met with widespread backlash, and @moss eventually locked it. In response, a few users created a new community on Blahaj: !onehundredninetysix@lemmy.blahaj.zone. The new community quickly grew in size and activity, with most users opting to stay on Blahaj rather than migrate to lemmy.world.

It’s clear @moss and the 196 moderators underestimated the community’s attachment to its home on Blahaj. By attempting to uproot the group without input, they alienated much of the community. As a result, most users have moved to the new Blahaj-hosted community, which has already become the more active space.

TL;DR:
@Moss and the 196 mod team tried to move the community to lemmy.world without consulting anyone. The decision was extremely unpopular, leading to backlash and the creation of a new Blahaj-hosted community that most users now prefer.

*This paragraph has been edited after receiving correction or clarification from @A_Very_Big_Fan@lemmy.world. You can find that discussion here.

**”Remain” being the key word here. Blahaj has openly held the same trans-focused policies as always, and the admin Ada was simply reasserting her position here.

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[–] PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat 76 points 1 day ago (16 children)

This kind of thing needs to happen way more often.

Moderators don't "own" the communities they host. They're just taking responsibility for the space. I actually really wish that their effort was rewarded with more of recognition and less of headache, but the answer to that is certainly not to say that they are the "boss" of the users in that community, and the users need to do what they say.

It's especially hilarious for 196 because they weren't actually taking on the moderation responsibility. Ada was. So they just wanted to show up and be the boss without doing anything in particular to help anybody. I hope the new community finds blahaj-native moderators and they find some fulfillment in keeping the space healthy and organized.

[–] sunzu2@thebrainbin.org 21 points 1 day ago (3 children)

they are the "boss" of the users in that community

Mods surely act like it, that's reddit modding culture at its core.

Back in my day when the forums were the backbone of online discussion modding was a janitorial job. Spammers, off topic, bad faith behavior got modded.

Reddit style modding is censorship of content and tone so that community is discussing topic with facts and tone that mod approves.

With that said most of fedi subs are modded properly but step into any higher traffic sub lime news and politics and then you are facing censorship.

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[–] Badeendje@lemmy.world 17 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Maybe moderators should be referred to as caretakers in the fediverse.. seems to fit the role much better.

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[–] A_Very_Big_Fan@lemmy.world 22 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (10 children)

However, 196 moderator @moss and their team remained unhappy with the policy.

None of us disagreed with this policy, and Drag was not banned over neopronouns. Drag was banned for an egregious level of harassment of another user + encouraging violence from and the suicide of trans people.

If y'all think that's acceptable behavior, that's fine, but keep it the fuck away from us. Half of the mod team is trans, and we don't need that shit in our lives.

[–] quirzle@lemmy.zip 20 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I don't see drag mentioned in the explanation post on the community this is about; what's the connection to the situation the OP is about?

[–] A_Very_Big_Fan@lemmy.world 12 points 1 day ago (1 children)

However, 196 moderator @moss and their team remained unhappy with the policy.

Not a single mod disagreed with this policy. While I'm sure it wasn't her intention, Ada's post certainly made it seem like it, though. You wouldn't believe how many times I've had to tell people why Drag was banned after she posted it.

[–] spujb@lemmy.cafe 14 points 1 day ago (1 children)

can you rephrase your point i think i and others are misunderstanding it bigtime like i personally can’t tell who you are responding to~

[–] A_Very_Big_Fan@lemmy.world 9 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

I'm not sure what you're confused about, honestly.

People harassed Drag and that wasn't okay, but during the backlash you mentioned in your post, many people pointed out that Drag had a legitimate history of "trolling", the most egregious of which was telling someone repeatedly to kill themselves, along with general calls for violence from and the suicide of trans people. We banned Drag for this.

So when Ada made her post, it looked like she was calling us out for labeling Drag a troll, and indeed that is the narrative a lot of you ran with.

So now that you've had a hand in perpetuating this misunderstanding, I'd appreciate it if you set the record straight. Because frankly, I'm sick of people like you labeling me and the other mods as bigots. I'm sick of you guys putting words in our mouths. If you're going to make a "writeup" about us, then tell them the real reason we wanted to leave LBZ.

[–] spujb@lemmy.cafe 7 points 1 day ago (11 children)

?

So I actually agree with everything you wrote here except that “that is the narrative a lot of you ran with.” I didn’t. And I told off everyone who did. I appreciated you banning Drag for the user’s disgusting behavior. You did the right thing. Ada was calling out commenters who were using harassment and misgendering to combat trolls. Most that were mad were upset at Ada. Few to none interpereted that as a diss on you. Certainly not me.

You are getting pretty acerbic about this already so if you do respond please be chill. But I would encourage you to engage with the concept that this wasn’t even about you until you made it that way by locking the community.

In general, this is showing me that you just really never even had a finger on the pulse of your own former community, so I think this has all been for the best.

[–] MothmanDelorian@lemmy.world 6 points 23 hours ago (1 children)

Op, I have no skin in this but can't you see that the post you have made contains the narrative you are being told is false?

[–] spujb@lemmy.cafe 4 points 23 hours ago (1 children)

i made an edit to the language of my post that might have been misleading a small minority, including you and AVBF. feel free to check it out and let me know if it makes more sense.

[–] MothmanDelorian@lemmy.world 3 points 22 hours ago (1 children)
[–] spujb@lemmy.cafe 4 points 22 hours ago

YIPPEE 🥳🥳🥳

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[–] donuts@lemmy.world 45 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (6 children)

For anyone thinking "it's their community, they can do what they want with it. Start your own if you disagree":

A lot of users (including myself) believe that a community fundamentally belongs to said community. It's not so much "you need to ask for permission to do X" but more like "is this what the community itself wants?"

Of course, not everything can be solved by community consensus, but to me, a community is nothing without the members. And if the members want X, Y or Z, provided it's within instance rules, moderators should help facilitate that.

[–] Blaze@feddit.org 34 points 1 day ago

I don't remember who said it, but the "community members are not cattle that you can just move around" seemed fit

[–] spujb@lemmy.cafe 29 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Precisely. Add to this that 196 has history that precedes both Lemmy and Blahaj zone. The 196 community is a group of humans with their own wills and values, irreverent to any mod or leader.

196 chose Blahaj and Ada. The mod team should have respected that.

[–] quirzle@lemmy.zip 9 points 1 day ago (1 children)

They certainly don't seem to see it that way, from this comment:

we aren’t stealing your community. the people who built and facilitated this community are the people who are migrating this community.

[–] spujb@lemmy.cafe 16 points 1 day ago

lmao sure enough

that comment was posted while !196@lemmy.blahaj.zone was still locked. it’s now unlocked.

at the time i think the mods hadn’t realized how deeply they stepped in it and thought it was simply a matter of misunderstanding that could be corrected. i think they are starting to catch up now.

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[–] streetfestival@lemmy.ca 11 points 1 day ago

Great write up, very clear! Fediverse for the win here 😎

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