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For Marriage, I suggest don't use Death Do Us Part Unless you mean it (lemmy.world)
submitted 18 hours ago by DaddysLittleSlut@lemmy.world to c/relationship_advice@lemmy.world
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I thought to just make a public post about this. I’ve seen many people get married with the vows “Death Do Us Part”

This is a good vow don’t get me wrong but I’d encourage finding an alternative that doesn’t include death unless you truly mean it. What this entails if you mean it,

If someone cheats. The other partner has the right to kill them, if one tries leaving without mutual agreement. The other one can kill them. It’s not about anything unhealthy but two people collectively agreeing to a statement.

If you don’t want that then something like Till Time Do Us Part.

This way there is no death involved and your relationship isn’t built on a false and shallow promise.

Like any weddings I go to. I will call out, if they ever ask if anyone opposes. Then I’ll explain this.

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[–] NGnius@lemmy.ca 5 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

It’s confusing why it’s such a big leap.

Because saying "I'll do [thing] until I die" is not the same as "If I stop doing [thing] you can kill me".

Also it’s odd to assume you’d break the vow after not accepting them cheating. From my cultural POV when you cheat. You’d forfeit the vow.

If the vow is broken by cheating, then the part of the vow about being lawfully wedded until death is also broken. So then you'd also lose your right to murder them to get out of the vow, since you're already out of the vow. If you'd like a fun take on divorce as murder, see The Orville's Moclans.

Which would bring dishonour upon your family and that includes a direct disrespect of the other family.

Is your culture Klingon? Because honour is not a real thing, it's just an excuse to shame people for doing things some don't like. If you've got a good reason why it has to be this way, I'd love to hear it. As it stands, that's just intolerance by peer pressure, which are both bad things to do. I'd encourage you to spend a bit of time doing some critical thinking about your culture, since I saw some of your other replies saying that some of your beliefs come from your culture. I come from a culture that still likes marriage a lot (Canada + Catholic), but that same culture is also responsible for (triggers incoming) genocide, child abuse, cultural cleansing, and rampant pollution.

Hey I cheated, or tried leaving (Not leaving because of abuse) since I believe if someone was abusing you. They’d also break the vow since the vow is to protect, love and care until death.

I'm not going to defend cheating too much, but the vow has no statement about monogamy (though that is usually and reasonably assumed to be the case) so the pedant in me would like to point out that cheating is not breaking the vow. Even with the reasonable assumption that cheating is breaking the vow, the vow does not set consequences for breaking it. Technically, divorce does not even break the vow. It is also possible to protect, love, and care until death while ending the marriage. Even after a divorce, your partner was still your lawfully wedded partner. (I don't really agree with this paragraph, but it's a totally valid opinion with some strong arguments so I wanted to mention it)

For Time do us part. While it may seem lesser. It’s acknowledging the flow of time and how someone can change throughout life. Though in reality there could be a better option but it’s more making it apparent the importance of meaningful statements.

I'd like to believe that the vow is acknowledgement that they intend to fulfill it until death. From that basic tenet and knowing that humans aren't perfect [citation needed], it's easy to come to the premise that somebody might grow to realize they can't fulfill that vow, and so they want to get a divorce. It's actually probably the most protective, loving, and caring thing a partner could do -- realize they aren't good with their partner and so leave. The fact that they broke the vow does not invalidate their intent to fulfill it when they started the marriage. This is basically the idea behind no-fault divorce, btw.

If you want to acknowledge time by changing the vow from "death" to "time", you're definitely allowed to for your own wedding. But don't presume that people don't understand the meaning of what they're saying because they made a vow that they ultimately didn't keep.

Here's a parting thought: Would a good partner ever murder their spouse? Is human life truly valued lower than this made up concept called "honour"?

[–] DaddysLittleSlut@lemmy.world 1 points 11 hours ago

Interesting to hear that first part honestly. Now the second part the reason why killing is ok within this case is because you have to regain your dignity and honour. A marriage is a binding of two souls and persons into one partnership. When one disgraces that partnership some are unforgivable aka cheating. Sometimes those who decide will forgive and give another chance but in this case most in my culture specifically the warrior side. Would never give a second chance. As for my culture no not Klingon but born into an ancient lineage of Norse and Frost Giant. With a secondary lineage by Pupil-ship. Ancient China. Now as for cheating. Of course it’s important to discuss the agreement before marriage. Like my Poly many times I can sleep with many people but for them to become part of my relationship everyone has to agree. For us at our official wedding. We will preform a ritual called the eternal bite of love. A bite to someone’s neck that creates a deep scar that will form a lasting mark.

Yes No Fault divorce at least for now is a thing until the upcoming president removes all them. Though I think it’s just most important to discuss how one see vows. So another doesn’t become misled. In the culture I’ve shared with kids, other partners. We all agree on at least one thing this Vow is life or death and cheating is equal to signing your death warrant.