this post was submitted on 20 Jun 2024
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I Will Fucking Piledrive You If You Mention AI Again — Ludicity (ludic.mataroa.blog)
submitted 4 months ago by Alphane_Moon@lemmy.world to c/technology@lemmy.world
137 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

How stupid do you have to be to believe that only 8% of companies have seen failed AI projects? We can't manage this consistently with CRUD apps and people think that this number isn't laughable? Some companies have seen benefits during the LLM craze, but not 92% of them. 34% of companies report that generative AI specifically has been assisting with strategic decision making? What the actual fuck are you talking about?

....

I don't believe you. No one with a brain believes you, and if your board believes what you just wrote on the survey then they should fire you.

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[–] Excrubulent@slrpnk.net 8 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

Wait wait wait so... this person forgot the pythagorean theorem?

Like that is the most basic task. It's d = sqrt((x1 - x2)^2 + (y1 - y2)^2), right?

That was off the top of my head, this person didn't understand that? Do I get a job now?

I have seen a lot of programmers talk about how much time it saves them. It's entirely possible it makes them very fast at making garbage code. One thing I've known for a long time is that understanding code is much harder than writing it, and so asking an LLM to generate your code sounds like it's just creating harder work for you, unless you don't care about getting it right.

[–] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 11 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Yup, you're hired as whatever position you want. :)

Our instructions were basically:

  1. randomly place N coordinates on a 2D grid, and a random target point
  2. report the closest of those N coordinates to the target point

It was technically different (we phrased it as a top-down game, but same gist). AI generated manhattan distance (abs(x2 - x1) + abs(x2 - x1)) probably due to other clues in the text, but the instructions were clear. The candidate didn't notice what it was doing, we pointed it out, then they asked for the algorithm, which we provided.

Our better candidates remember the equation like you did. But we don't require it, since not all applicants finished college (this one did). We're more concerned about code structure, asking proper questions, and software design process, but math knowledge is cool too (we do a bit of that).

[–] frezik@midwest.social 7 points 4 months ago (1 children)

College? Pythagorean Theorem is mid-level high school math.

I did once talk to a high school math teacher about a graphics program I was hacking away on at the time, and she was surprised that I actually use the stuff she teaches. Which is to say that I wouldn't expect most programmers to know it exactly off the top of their head, but I would expect they've been exposed to it and can look it up if needed. I happen to have it pretty well ingrained in my brain.

[–] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 5 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Yes, you learn it in the context of finding the hypotenuse of a triangle, but:

  • a lot of people are "bad" at math (more unconfident), but good with logic
  • geometry, trig, etc require a lot of memorization, so it's easy to forget things
  • interviews are stressful, and good applicants will space on basic things

So when I'm interviewing, I try to provide things like algorithms that they probably know but are likely to space on, and focus on the part I care about: can they reason their way through a problem and produce working code, and then turn around and review their code. Programming is mostly googling stuff (APIs, algorithms, etc), I want to know if they can google the right stuff.

And yeah, we let applicants look stuff up, we just short circuit the less important stuff so they have time to show us the important parts. We dedicate 20-30 min to coding (up to an hour if they rocked at questions and are struggling on code), and we expect a working solution and for them to ask questions about vague requirements. It's a software engineering test, not a math test.

[–] Excrubulent@slrpnk.net 2 points 4 months ago

Yeah, that's absolutely fair, and it's a bit snobby of me to get all up in arms about forgetting a formula - although it is high school level where I live. But to be handed the formula, informed that there's an issue and still not fix it is the really hard part to wrap my head around, given it's such a basic formula.

I guess I'm also remembering someone I knew who got a programming job off the back of someone else's portfolio, who absolutely couldn't program to save their life and revealed that to me in a glaring way when I was trying to help them out. It just makes me think of that study that was done that suggested that there might be a "programmer brain" that you either have or you don't. They ended up costing that company a lot to my knowledge.