Over the past five years, Iโve worked hard to persuade my friends and family to drop WhatsApp and switch to Signal. I don't want to ask them to change platforms againโespecially since Signal is open-source, and thereโs currently no compelling reason for me to abandon it.
this post was submitted on 14 Apr 2025
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Buy European
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Element sadly collects metadata.
Could be argued that Lemmy does too. I realise the use case is different but the risk feels similar. You can sign up with a anonymous username, your phone number isn't exposed and some Matrix instances don't even require an email (and if they do you can use an anonymising service). Its not great, I agree, but its also not that bad either.
My issue with Element X (and the reason I'm still using Element) is that X doesn't (yet) support Spaces. Again, not a huge issue, but annoying enough to stop me switching.
SchildiChat Next, which is based on Element X, has implemented spaces.
Lemmy isn't trying to be the paragon of security, but a totally open discussion thingy lol. It's like saying there is lower security in public speeches.
Which is why I said I was aware the use case is different. I'm also not sure Element is trying to be a paragon of security. As I understand it, their focus is on privacy.
Iโm not sure about which metadata is collected by Element, but it might be possible to correlate data, for example through fingerprinting. So it might be possible to know who the parties communicating with each other are and when and with whom they have communicated with, even though they did not provide phone/email.
With Signal, as far as I know and they claim, that is not possible. The only data Signal has is your phone number, when youโve signed up and when you last logged in.
So with my limited knowledge Iโd say Signal is much more private for personal communication. Especially if youโre not tech savvy and take additional measures.
And Lemmy is a social message board. There is no expectation of privacy here.
Element is just a matrix client, and it doesnt collect data itself. What is relevant is choosing appropiate instance, which dont require you to use email etc
I really struggle with so boild down posts as Signal, Threema and Matrix are the three that get mentioned a lot lately, but they aren't equally easy to use, nor is their feature set equal.
For example: in terms of data privacy I would rate them Matrix, Threema, Signal. In terms of usability and ease of use Signal, Threema, Matrix. Also Matrix works more like a business chat replacement (e.g. for slack, teams, ...).
Using all three actively, I often get the feeling that recommendations are not based on the needs of the people the recommendation is made for. 99.99% of the users just want to have a messaging App without instances and login procedure. And I'm quite sure a vast part of those using Lemmy are already in the remainder that know about Matrix ๐
Anyhow, for everybody else there are nerdy overviews like https://www.messenger-matrix.de/messenger-matrix-en.html
The experience on Matrix depends on the client.
Fluffuchat feels more like WhatsApp, Element like Slack.
I know german schools forked fluffychat for their students. Also German Army opted for Matrix/element. Still, all on an organizational level.
Some companies use WhatsApp for internal communication
The Fluffychat devs want it to be easier and intuitive ("no one should be left behind" https://fluffychat.im/)
The screenshot show that the app is similar to WhatsApp or Signal https://github.com/krille-chan/fluffychat
Companies also use Threema for secure company chat. But again, my point was: Matrix is not the solution to any use case. That simple.
It could use a bit more explanation, but I like Matrix because of its structure:
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you have the normal chat function
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group functions
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you can create rooms and spaces for larger topics
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you have a direct overview of whether the files in the chat are safe
This is also very handy for me in the family area, because I can divide and separate different topics in such a way that I can avoid a longer topic taking up entire chat groups that are actually meant for something completely different.
Matrix in particular always gives me the feeling of having a messenger with a forum where I can communicate and socialise both locally and internationally.
It's also my file-sharing app (as it's pre-installed on Linux), as Warpinator is only available for Android.
But yes, I would definitely recommend Signal for its speed of use, Threema is more or less the same but with a premium. With Matrix, you need to get used to it before you can use all the functions.
I really wanted it to use as an alternative for WhatsApp for our family. However, I'm the "tech guy" in the family and really struggled to get it to work for my wife and me. So, I didn't see how my family would be able to use it.
Maybe I'll have to try it again. Or look into flufffluff or however it's called.
A bit more explanation from whom?
Sorry, I mean from the OP of course. A little bit about the special features, functions and the company behind it, so that users can categorise the various app suggestions a bit and perhaps also know that there are definitely differences between Signal, Threema and Matrix/Element.
But as a committed Matrix/Element user, I am glad that Matrix/Element is finally a real recommendation. :D
It was and is, all the time (since day one at r/buyFromEU).
The question is: what is it an alternative too? Slack, rocketchat, mattermostโฆ WhatsApp, Threema, Signal.
They got different selling-points and making an account and fiddeling with verifying clients is none of WhatsApp or Signal.
I would like it very much as an organizational chat solution, but I would wanโt to onboard clueless users like my family ๐ฌ
Matrix is very close to being a good replacement for discord.
Iโve just bridged all my chats using the mautrix bridges. All looks seamlessly puppeted on matrix. Even emojis and pinned messages make it across.
The Element X app which uses matrix 2.0 is lacking a few features (like spaces) but I think itโll take over once they get it right.
Because XMPP is not an open standard I guess...
Wasn't matrix developed by Amdocs initially? which has ties to the Israeli intelligence infrastructure?
This combined with the collection of metadata would be a redflag for me.
I recently used matrix as a replacement for me and my gf. And I was really surprised on how easy it is to setup and do video calls. Still need to figure out the puppeting thing for whatsapp and Im golden
Isnโt Element janky and bloated?
A group of mine is currently discussing migrating to Matrix. Among the arguments, it's said to be more popular than our current messenging protocol, but it's also said to be a drain on battery.
I saw one comparison saying the official Matrix client on Android drain battery 10x faster than some well written XMPP clients. So I'm not going to migrate for now. May reconsider once Matrix clients reduce battery usage significantly.
I've been using Matrix for a couple of years and I've noticed to problem with battery drain. My kids use SchildiChat, I used to use Element but recently switched to Element X which is nicer, I think.
I don't think they will, I think you're supposed to use unified push instead.
Not necessarily. Conversations have reasonable battery usage without using Googleโs push messaging system (GCM). They rely instead on XMPP protocol features and client optimisations to limit battery usage.