this post was submitted on 25 Jun 2025
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The revived No JS Club celebrates websites that don't use Javascript, the powerful but sometimes overused code that's been bloating the web and crashing tabs since 1995. The No CSS Club goes a step further and forbids even a scrap of styling beyond the browser defaults. And there is even the No HTML Club, where you're not even allowed to use HTML. Plain text websites!

The modern web is the pure incarnation of evil. When Satan has a 1v1 with his manager, he confers with the modern web. If Satan is Sauron, then the modern web is Melkor [1]. Every horror that you can imagine is because of the modern web. Modern web is not an existential risk (X-risk), but is an astronomic suffering risk (S-risk) [2]. It is the duty of each and every man, woman, and child to revolt against it. If you're not working on returning civilization to ooga-booga, you're a bad person.

A compromise with the clubs is called for. A hypertext brutalism that uses the raw materials of the web to functional, honest ends while allowing web technologies to support clarity, legibility and accessibility. Compare this notion to the web brutalism of recent times, which started off in similar vein but soon became a self-subverting aesthetic: sites using 2.4MB frameworks to add text-shadow: 40px 40px 0px hotpink to 400kb Helvetica webfonts that were already on your computer.

I also like the idea of implementing "hypotext" as an inversion of hypertext. This would somehow avoid the failure modes of extending the structure of text by failing in other ways that are more fun. But I'm in two minds about whether that would be just a toy (e.g. references banished to metadata, i.e. footnotes are the hypertext) or something more conceptual that uses references to collapse the structure of text rather than extend it (e.g. links are includes and going near them spaghettifies your brain). The term is already in use in a structuralist sense, which is to say there are 2 million words of French I have to read first if I want to get away with any of this.

Republished Under Creative Commons Terms. Boing Boing Original Article.

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I fucking hate JavaScript

[–] ThePowerOfGeek@lemmy.world 187 points 1 week ago (1 children)

JavaScript, AJAX, and modern web frameworks have pushed us away from displaying information in a pure and clean way. We need to go back to a better time!

Looks at no-HTML websites

Shit, we've gone back too far!

[–] b_tr3e@feddit.org 78 points 1 week ago (17 children)

CSS on the other hand is quite essential to separate layout from content. Which is a good thing, so I can't really think of a reason for a "no-CSS" rule. Specifically if you can use inline styles as well but in a way more messy way.

[–] garretble@lemmy.world 22 points 1 week ago (1 children)

CSS is useful but also the devil.

[–] SonOfAntenora@lemmy.world 21 points 1 week ago (2 children)

CSS is mostly evil when you have to center elements in the page.

[–] garretble@lemmy.world 26 points 1 week ago (15 children)

text-align: center

or

margin: auto

or

grid

or

flexbox

It's really not that hard now.

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[–] Absaroka@lemmy.world 58 points 1 week ago (8 children)

I do wonder if we're going to see some websites popping up that kind of hit the reset button on social media and go back to smaller communities of folks with something in common.

I kind of miss the days of actually having online conversations with folks you know are real people (not bots), that aren't trying to be an influencer, or get famous, or some how many money off your interactions.

[–] meejle@lemmy.world 25 points 1 week ago (8 children)

I think it'll happen, but I don't think it's happening yet.

The unease is already there ("the internet used to be a place"/"why isn't the internet fun any more?" sentiments and #OldWeb #SlowWeb hashtags), but I don't think people are ready to do anything about it.

I'm only one guy, with a small internet following, but I recently had a go at launching a small "Gaymers" webring (well, a simplified version of one). I promoted it on my socials, I laid out why I think it's a good idea, I paid to "Blaze" it on Tumblr – I even emailed some like-minded creators directly.

I rewrote the webpage multiple times, to try to make it more persuasive and more concise. I added a contact form in case people felt uncomfortable emailing me. I loosened the rules to allow commercial websites, as long as they were still independent. I worked hard on the widget and incorporated feedback (made it respect prefers-reduced-motion and made a static version for sites where animation would feel out of place).

I got some good feedback; lots of people said it was interesting, and a good idea. But literally no one joined or expressed any interest in joining. 🤷‍♂️

I'm going to have one more go at promoting it next time I've got money to spare, but I'll most likely end up quietly deleting it along with any evidence it existed, because a webring of one is fucking embarrassing. 💀

I guess if you build it, they will not necessarily come lmao

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[–] umbraroze@slrpnk.net 57 points 1 week ago (8 children)

"No HTML club" is kinda going too far on the Web. If you go there you might as well start a No HTTP Club and serve stuff over Gopher and FTP.

But we definitely need an HTML 2.0 Club.

[–] ChuckTheMonkey@fedia.io 20 points 1 week ago (5 children)

Might as well do no digital club and we exchange information through mail and pigeons.

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[–] some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org 50 points 1 week ago (1 children)
[–] Retro_unlimited@lemmy.world 42 points 1 week ago (6 children)

Just earlier I was reading about this website hosted on solar power and the extremes they went through to get the website to be simple so very little data is transmitted to save precious watts.

The website https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/about/the-solar-website/

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[–] Matriks404@lemmy.world 40 points 1 week ago (7 children)

What we need is a subset of modern web, without any bloat, especially JS frameworks.

A lot of websites can be static HTML + CSS.

[–] elbarto777@lemmy.world 11 points 1 week ago

The subset exists. What you're referring to is an agreement or convention.

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[–] CriticalMiss@lemmy.world 37 points 1 week ago (4 children)

I can get behind no JS club, I can’t get behind no CSS club.

CSS is 🆒

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[–] the_q@lemmy.zip 27 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Get this bs outta here. I write on paper! No one knows my thoughts or feelings!!

[–] stormeuh@lemmy.world 12 points 1 week ago (5 children)

What devilry is this? Written word? Real cultures use oral history to store knowledge!

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[–] ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net 22 points 1 week ago

Pfff, that's nothing. My club doesn't even have a website.

[–] vantablack@lemmy.blahaj.zone 20 points 1 week ago (3 children)
[–] tehBishop@sh.itjust.works 2 points 5 days ago

Those websites are amazing, thank you.

I checked the source to find the song only to realized I already had it in my playlist 😂

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[–] AmidFuror@fedia.io 18 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I am in the "whistling into the phone handset on a dialup connection is the purest form of online communication" club.

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[–] IllNess@infosec.pub 18 points 1 week ago (2 children)
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[–] LovableSidekick@lemmy.world 15 points 1 week ago (5 children)

I'll say one thing for the No CSS philosophy - at least it eliminates light-colored text on a light-colored background using the thinnest possible font, which is probably the stupidest stylistic trend since the web began.

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[–] moseschrute@lemmy.ml 14 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children)

Just out of curiosity what percentage of people here are using Voyager as their Lemmy client?

Spoiler

Voyager wouldn’t work without JavaScript… shhh don’t tell anyone

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[–] rottingleaf@lemmy.world 14 points 1 week ago (3 children)

How do you use hyperlinks without HTML?

[–] dubyakay@lemmy.ca 28 points 1 week ago (1 children)
[–] Banthex@feddit.org 27 points 1 week ago (8 children)

Jesus. This is getting out of hand.

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[–] LainTrain@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 points 1 week ago

Might be more accessible than gopherholes and gemini gems(?)

[–] owl@infosec.pub 11 points 1 week ago (5 children)

no http club, who is joining?

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[–] alansuspect@aussie.zone 11 points 1 week ago

JavaScript, the powerful but sometimes overused code

now there's an understatement.

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