this post was submitted on 29 Jun 2023
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    When WSL2 first came out, some losers on /g/ were cheering that it would "make Linux obsolete". Four years later, I think it's safe to say they were kinda missing the point. (vlemmy.net)
    submitted 2 years ago by amanwithausername@vlemmy.net to c/linuxmemes@lemmy.world
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    [–] Flemmy@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

    That's funny, I did the opposite - I got used to developing on osx, then Linux, but that was always on my work computer - my desktop has always been Windows (I'm still using the same license and chassis from the computer I bought in high school a decade and a half ago).

    Then I burnt out hard, and started picking up contracts here and there, but didn't have the money to pick up a second computer powerful enough for gaming or work. So I ran virtualbox and avoided cmd like the plague for a while... It was driving me nuts, so I made plans to run Linux with Windows in a hypervisor - I was looking at pci passthrough so I could give it direct access to the graphics card.

    But then wsl came out and it just didn't seem as important. Even as Linux gaming has grown, I just haven't felt the need to switch... It's sometimes finicky and setting everything up on a new computer is a pain, but the only time I considered switching one of my machines over is setting up LLMs - that was a real pain to coax into working, and it'd run better on Linux

    [–] IntoTheFediverse@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

    My favorite windows feature. Being broken.

    [–] sauron@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

    Linux is Linux.

    WSL is Bill Gates' wet fart of an OS running Linux.

    Definitely not the same thing.

    [–] Cringe2793@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

    Is it not? It's basically a Linux container running on Windows, isn't it?

    [–] dustyData@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

    But it is Ubuntu, it essentially negates any benefit from being Linux.

    But seriously, you still have to sift through all the worst of Windows to make it to Linux. When you could be, you know, just using Linux and avoid the dead weight.

    [–] Cringe2793@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

    You can install distros other than Ubuntu though. But what's wrong with Ubuntu anyway?

    I'm using it on a daily basis, and I haven't really encountered any real issues, so for me it's fine.

    [–] sudo@lemmy.fmhy.ml 0 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    Ah, yes, the feature to update the operating system that is by default enabled but is able to be disabled completely.

    If a *nix user can't figure out how to disable automatic updates, it's on them.

    [–] dustyData@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

    I mean, it's never an issue for a power user, which arguably most Linux advocates are. But the disable option available for the average user is known to be overridden by MS. And the way that is not susceptible to MS remote meddling requires a Pro license, technical knowledge, installation of advanced system administration tools. All things that most people either don't have, or are not allowed (restricted permissions in corporate equipment, etc.), or rightfully don't care to invest time into doing. So this is still a common occurrence.

    [–] entropicshart@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago

    Yeah this always baffled me; I love Linux and use it as a core for all my projects (containerized and VM), but disabling updates on windows takes about two minutes to open run > gpedit.msc > set auto updates to false

    Are people really able to configure full Linux boxes to their liking but struggle to tick one box?

    [–] kbity@kbin.social 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

    Meanwhile, the huge improvements that Proton has gone through since 2018 have made Windows damn near obsolete for myself and many other Linux users. I really only keep it around on my gaming machine for VR titles and if I want to use Discord screen sharing (since they still haven't fixed the lack of audio on Linux) at this point, and my main laptop has been Windows-free for years now.

    [–] amanwithausername@vlemmy.net 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

    since they still haven’t fixed the lack of audio on Linux

    Huh, never heard of this. Do you mean that it's impossible to stream desktop audio through discord? As a workaround, you can try switching to Pipewire and patching your audio output's monitor into Discord through helvum. Or write a script that does that automatically.

    [–] kbity@kbin.social 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

    Yeah, when you stream your desktop from Linux over Discord, your desktop's audio doesn't come through. It's been a known issue for years but it's a very low priority fix for Discord's developers.

    Does the method you're describing play well with speaking at the same time, or do you have to decide whether you want speech or audio?

    [–] amanwithausername@vlemmy.net 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

    Does the method you’re describing play well with speaking at the same time

    Yes.
    With pipewire, it is possible to patch two sources (i.e. your microphone and an application's audio) into a single input, and it will mix them together into one stream. I just tested this with Audacity (didn't feel like booting up Discord, but it should work the same). I could hear my voice and the application's audio at the same time. This is what it looked like for me in Helvum:

    The gray PortAudio block is Audacity (would be Discord in your case). "ALC3232 Analog" is my microphone (on the left) and my headphones (on the right). Music Player Daemon is the application whose audio I wanted to stream. The connection between the microphone and Audacity was made automatically as soon as I started the recording. I had to manually make the connections from Music Player Daemon to Audacity for both left and right channels. After that I could see both the mic sound and the music player daemon sound in the recording, mixed into one stream. It should work the same way with Discord. If you wanted to, for example, make your voice louder or quiter compared to the application audio, you could just adjust your mic's gain (or the application's volume) with Pavucontrol (it's an app made for Pulseaudio, but it works flawlessly under pipewire as well).

    In my original comment, I said that you could patch your output's monitor back into Discord. This is a bad idea, since if anyone speaks to you in the call, that audio will also be echoed back to them. So it's better to connect the individual applications' audio into Discord as opposed to the output monitor.

    Now, this could get a little tedious, making those connections by hand every time you want to screen share. So you could try to make a script that does something like that automatically. Pipewire also has the concept of a "session manager", which is basically a daemon that decides which connections are made by default, when new sources or sinks register with Pipewire. For example, wireplumber, the default session manager, was responsible for connection audacity to my microphone automatically. Maybe you could try to configure your session manager to also automatically make connection between Discord and any app that outputs audio (idk tho, never done it before).

    [–] kbity@kbin.social 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

    Huh, this is all very informative. Thanks for the breakdown. I'll have to see if I can get Pipewire going on my gaming setup.

    [–] eltimablo@kbin.social 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

    There's also discord-screenaudio on Flathub if you don't feel like doing the work yourself. It works out of the box for me.

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    [–] addie@feddit.uk 0 points 2 years ago (6 children)

    Combines the power of a really half-arsed Linux distro with the pure speed of the Windows file system.

    I mean, it's slightly better than nothing, but installing a real Linux distro on Windows through eg. VirtualBox absolutely fucks it into the bin. I don't see who WSL is for. People in really locked-down corporate environments?

    [–] SpaceCadet2000@kbin.social 1 points 2 years ago

    I don't see who WSL is for. People in really locked-down corporate environments?

    That's me pretty much. Locked down low spec Windows 10 laptop that would probably suffocate under the weight of a full VM anyway, so I'm happy to have access to a proper Linux shell with a nice-ish terminal that's a lot less clunky than "git bash", MingW etc.

    I use it for ad hoc scripting and things like interacting with webservices (curl), massaging text files with tools like jq, sed, awk and to use Azure and AWS cli tools to interact with cloud infrastructure.

    [–] amanwithausername@vlemmy.net 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

    I don’t see who WSL is for.

    My guess is that this time they really wanted to pull the developer demographic over into the M$ sphere of influence. MSYS, MingW, and Git Shell already fill the same niche as WSL, so it wasn't destined to succeed. Thing is, they probably didn't expect it to succeed either. Microsoft's strategy has always been to throw a hundred dicks at the wall and hope that one of them sticks (think Zune, Windows Phone, etc). This time, Azure kind of stuck. WSL didn't. When you're as big as Microsoft, the occasional win more than covers the cost of a hundred fails.

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