Once a project is forked away, you no longer have any control at all.

What does that mean in the context of lemmy's license? As I understand it, everyone is allowed to fork it away, but not allowed to change the license. Which allows everyone to fork it further away or back.

I don't understand what control means in this context. Isn't it a thing people can just modify and use, now and for all future?

if they closed registrations on those instances, lots of the new users would end up confused, and go post on reddit that lemmy isn’t allowing new registrations.

I think anyways the registration process should be dumbed down. Simple version:

• User sees no instances or servers during registration
• When they click on 'register', a random instance (which allows new registrations) is chosen
• There is a small link 'advanced options' which allows users to see and choose instances

This would balance the load between instances and make it much easier for newcomers to join.

I realize we were talking about slightly different views. You had a scenario in mind where people try to join a specific instance (for example because someone promoted that specific instance somewhere else), I was talking about https://join-lemmy.org/

Compare it to e-mail. If you want to switch provider you have to backup and restore your emails if you want to.

When moving to another mail provider, I can forward mails going to the old address to the new one.

When moving to another lemmy account (technically creating an unconnected second one), I have no way to be notified of replies to posts or comments I made with the old account.

There are a couple other use cases where the comparison doesn't really hold. My hopes are on Moving user profile to a new instance #1985, but it probably won't be implemented any time soon.

Interesting that it's possible with RES. But it requires the user to copy paste some code.

A better automated approach:

PowerDeleteSuite. Smooth process, can recommend. AMA if you have troubles or questions.

Also allows you to replace posts/comments with another text, for example hints where to go instead.

Whenever you see inserted words, please imagine an awkwardly moving but very colorful parrot squawking it.

The ability to ~~find and~~ make these ~~connections~~ prrrofits is incredibly important to ~~many people~~ ourrr sharrreholders, and ensuring that active communities are able to remain [a] stable and active ~~(and open)~~ source of prrrofits is very important forrr us!

Our goal here is to work ~~with~~ the existing mod team ~~to find a path forward~~ into exile and make sure your subreddit is usable for the ~~community~~ company which makes its ~~home~~ monnney here.

That's fine, they can try? Just as anyone else can have different goals and pursue them.

I really like this openness of the fediverse in arguments like these. We don't have to agree, it's alright.

Thanks! If lemmy wants to grow (and I do want that), it better listens to people who share their struggle.

It is irrelevant wether we find that struggle justified, wether we deem him worthy of joining, wether his assessment of the situation is correct. Even an ill informed rejection can help us improve.

Most users who face similar problems will just go away, never come back and not share anything to learn from. This person shares their point of view, and that's a great resource to improve the user experience right from the welcome page.

This perspective is especially valuable, since once you managed to get through that process and familiarized yourself with the system, your view has changed. It can be hard to assume an uninformed perspective again. But we need to make lemmy accessible especially for this audience, because they are the only ones who can make it grow by joining.

---

So, what did we get?

1. "The homepage is literally some bs about servers."
2. "Where are all the discussions happening?"
3. "This federated stuff is all nice and cool technically but what's the product?"
4. He's looking for "Discussions. Alternatives for subreddits."
5. "How do I search for Formula1 and Tennis?"
6. "I created an account and it asks me to login again"
7. "A link from search takes me to another server and asks me to login again"
8. "If a human needs to explain how to use a platform [...]"

We'll come back to this later.

---

Let's compare the experience on https://www.reddit.com/ and https://join-lemmy.org/ from the point of view of an unfamiliar user who might want to create an account.

On reddit, without being logged in:

• biggest part of the screen in the middle is occupied by actual posts
• user can scroll for more content and already gets a feeling how the regular experience might be within the first seconds, even before creating an account. Comment section is accessible, posts can even be shared without being logged in.
• top part of the feed is four exemplary posts which draw further attention to actual content
• left panel is categorized subs, which gives an impression what kind of content can be expected, and acts as a search function for those who cannot put into words what they are looking for
• right panel is almost the same, categorized subreddits. It's hard to miss!
• top panel is a huge search box which can be used without leaving/changing the site
• bottom left and top right: Two big, bright orange buttons which start registration.

In short, reddit is filled with what most users come for, right from the start. It takes their wish so serious that there are many ways to check out the core content (center feed, four exemplary posts) or categories (left and right) or search (top, left, right).

This redundancy with slight variations can address different people who are used to different things. A person coming from an image-centered platform like instagram might go for the four exemplary posts which look like image thumbnails, while a person coming from a text-based forum will intuitively go for the center feed. Both ways directly lead to and familiarize with the core content without the need to log in.

The registration process is simple, the buttons are very visible and again redundant in opposing corners of the screen. Everything happens on one page which does not need to explain anything in text, because it is intuitively accessible.

On join-lemmy:

• biggest part of the screen is occupied by a rather technical explanation what lemmy is
• there is a hint of actual content in the background, but it is blurred out and inaccessible
• when I scroll to move the explanation away, I get more technial explanations which seems to address server admins, not users. A regular user might feel unwelcomed at this point. "Is this the right thing for me?"
• Two big buttons at the top: "Join a server" and "Run a server".
• No way to see how content is displayed, how it feels to interact with content.
• No way to search for content or communities. Does lemmy even have what I am seeking?
• When clicking on "Join a Server", a second lengthy, complicated page opens.
• The user is greeted with more explanation, including three links to more explanations.
• There is also a link to https://browse.feddit.de/. This is the first time users can check what content is available. It's a bulky view with roughly 2.4 hits per page. The biggest link in each hit opens an explanation box. The smaller link actually leads to content. This is the fastest way for new users from the welcome page to an experience similar to when they simply open reddit.com.
• Now users have to decide and choose a server and click "Join"
• No registration mask, instead they are redirected to the instance's main page.
• On this third page of their journey, users have to find the Login/Signup buttons again (which look like other buttons and are less visible than other buttons), and click one to start registration.

---

Let's revisit what your friend said:

1. "The homepage is literally some bs about servers."

That is correct. Most of the information on https://join-lemmy.org/ seems to be geared towards people who are interested in running a server. This is not what people expect when they are looking for something like reddit as a user. This will most certainly scare some people away, or cause confusion.

Solution: Hide the tech talk. Address the regular crowd. People who want to run a server can manage to find it somewhere "hidden". People who want to share cat pics cannot.

2. "Where are all the discussions happening?"

He shares his interest, and expresses feeling helpless in finding it. Until they discover a specific link on page 2 (and invest a couple more clicks), users cannot see what's going on inside lemmy, or wether there is even anything going on. Things which some newcomers honestly won't know at this point.

Solution: Bring our star, the content, center stage. This is what people come for. Don't make them search for it, we don't have to hide it.

3. "This federated stuff is all nice and cool technically but what's the product?"
4. He's looking for "Discussions. Alternatives for subreddits."
5. "How do I search for Formula1 and Tennis?"

Expressed frustration: "This is not what I was looking for. Where is what I was looking for?" All the technical explanation cannot convey what a direct content presentation conveys in a few seconds. How does lemmy look like, what does it feel like, how can I use it, what people and topics are there?

6. "I created an account and it asks me to login again"

He seemed to expect to be logged in after registration. Yeah, why not? Some sites do this, others do not. I also find it mildly annoying to log in after registration, to repeat myself.

7. "A link from search takes me to another server and asks me to login again"

I spent 3 days learning lemmy and am still struggling with this. This will trip over so many users. https://midwest.social/c/cats will throw you out, but /c/cats@midwest.social hidden in a link works fine. Would be nice if lemmy could automatically do this for me when clicking on a link to another instance while being logged in.

8. "If a human needs to explain how to use a platform [...]"

Absolutely right, that's a UX design smell. Your friend was lucky to have you to ask. Most users will be alone on their journey. A good portion will turn around when they find server talk where they expected a reddit scrolling substitute.

The process of choosing an instance should be simplified, be hidden from users. Advanced users can still have that freedom.

---

Sorry if I was harsh in my words at some points. It's not because I despise lemmy, but because I love it and want to stay here. But I also loved to have so much people and content around me on reddit, to be part of the one page people turn to when they are unhappy with Google results. I want lemmy to shine, and to grow. To achieve this goal, it is imperative to review how we approach new users, because there is no other way for us to grow but to win them. Let's help them help us. Make joining easy and fun.

There are maybe 4 or so ‘crawlers’, and the rest buys access to the part of their data they are willing to sell to others.

And then there is Yep. Just Yep.

You fine? Yep. You prefer being alone? Yep.

Should be possible to use another UI or just another theme without needing to redo all the backend work.

If it currently has no UI/theme switcher, then some backend work might be required, but still much less than making a new app from scratch.

Valid point, but even then, the two groups overlap.

The title seems to suggest that all Gamers were male. The article mostly talks about how that is not the case. It refers to these vocal gamers as 'some annoying dudes' within the text. Evidently, only some Gamers reacted poorly, but omitting the "some" makes for a more clickbaity=better headline.

The irony is, this headline strengthens the very stereotype the article aims to combat.

people in recovery from addiction and alcohol saying how they keep seeing ads for beer or gambling

Not that this is how it works, but I imagine a diligent algorithm looking at those individuals and that content, and then thinking "mhhmm this will generate maximum revenue!!".

Good idea! Apparently most of my subs participated, so I only had to unsub a few times. Eerie view to see an empty front page after I was done, never had that.

Apart from this short visit, I stay away from reddit.