bobr

Well, it seems that we won't come to an agreement here.

As I said, for me mass forbidding people to leave the country is unjustifiable. If some regime does it, whatever the reason, it deserves to be destroyed, and I wholeheartedly support the destruction of that regime. I wouldn't like to live under such a regime and wouldn't wish it for other people.

And yeah, I'm not going to stop caring about mine and other people's freedom :)

There can be no justification for mass forbidding people to leave the country.

country desperately defending themselves

This is exactly the same justification Zelensky is using. Both are wrong.

But what is the contradiction here? :)

In my mind North Korea associates with people being unable to leave it (which you don't deny), Zelensky did the same to Ukraine, therefore the analogy.

Spoiler alert, the two words are "No Gamechanger".

I don't know what could be a "gamechanger" in a war where one side (of course the good one) prevents its people from leaving the country, kidnaps people from the streets to sends them to the frontlines to die, and then has the audacity to complain that people are deserting in record high numbers and either try to escape the country or hide until the regime falls... :/

Well, I wasn't saying that NK kidnaps and massacres its citizens like Zelensky's regime does, I was referring to not being able to leave the country, and in that regard the regimes seems similar to me.

I mean they have a grand total of 3 borders of which one is shoot to kill zone, and while they have to get passport and probably visa too they can go to China and Russia, though the numbers aren't that high afaik.

So it's not a problem for North Koreans to obtain a passport and cross the border into China/Russia (and from there to any other country, of course provided that that country will let them in)? From what I've heard it's next to impossible, but if that's just western/American propaganda I'd like to read some articles and learn something new.

I have looked only at the name of the links and not the actual content (there are too many of them) - but I didn't notice anything about North Koreans being able to leave the country by means other than "illegally" crossing the border (this is the criterian I used to compare the countries)? If one of the links covers this topic I'd be interested in reading it.

Are people in Russian-occupied territories free to protest against Russia's invasion of Ukraine? No. They would get put in prison, or worse. So they aren't free.

The only free people in this reality are billionaires. It's not about who is free, it is about who is more free. Are you trying to say that people on liberated territories are less free than people on Zelensky controlled territories because.. they can protest Russia's invasion of Ukraine? So the ability to protest Russia's invasion of Ukraine is more important than freedom of movement and not being kidnapped from the streets?

I do think Ukrainians should be allowed to leave Ukraine.

Well thank you at least for that (that's not even sarcasm btw, that's already more helpful than most of the world), but again - you support Zelensky's regime which is the one making it impossible.

But you seem to be blaming Zelenskyy for the Russian shells, being fired by Russian forces.

I blame him for turning Ukraine into his North Korea. I blame him for trapping people, who die trying to cross the border by mountains/rivers, or hide at homes afraid to leave. I blame him for kidnapping people from the streets and sending them to the meatgrinder (so, killing them).

For some reason you don't want to put any blame at all on the Kremlin - why is that?

Here it is: I condemn Kremlin, Russia, Putin and everybody else responsible for this war.

But "Ukraine bad", "Russia good" right? Why criticizing only Ukraine and Zelensky since they're defending their land and not even a word against Russia or Putin?

I never said "Russia good".
Here, just for you: Russia and Putin are bad.

You make it seem like that surrendering to an invasion is the right thing to do.

No, I don't.

So if Russia decided to invade the whole of Europe we should sit waiting for russian soldiers to rape our sisters and moms and execute us with our hands tied behind our back?

No, you are free to do what you want, including fighting Russia. But if you try to to kill me, my family, my friends - don't be surprised that I'd rather support Russia than you..

Moreover, in occupied Ukraine people get drafted anyways by Russia to fight Ukrainian soldiers. So what? Should they surrender waiting to go to the opposite side?

People who accept Russian citizenship (which is generally not forced onto anyone) may get drafted (there was some exemption though for people on liberated territories till 2024, not sure if it's still in effect though). People are frre to leave at any moment though.
This is also wrong, but in no way comparable to Zelensky's regime kidnapping people on the streets every single day and trapping them in the country. (There were some cases of that happening in LPR & DPR previously, which is also terrible, but again not nearly on a similar scale to what Zelensky is doing)

Maybe if blood thirsty dictator putin didn't start a war of aggression, there could have been 0 deaths.

That's probably correct. I'm not Putin though, could you please not hold me accountable for his actions?

I'd rather die fighting russia than dying by their firing squad, being raped, tortured, electrocuted or malnourished in their prisons.

Ok, that's your choice, you are free to do whatever you want, including dying for your beliefs, it is not a problem.
A problem begins when you want/support other people dying for your beliefs.

Lol, people usually report me because "spreading misinformation/propaganda" or something along those lines, but @SomeGuy69@lemmy.world is more creative and reported this comment for "talking like a true rapist" :D