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Yet another one of China's elite has disappeared after criticizing Xi Jinping
(www.businessinsider.com)
this post was submitted on 24 Sep 2024
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Any time someone describes something that happened on the fediverse without providing a link, they are misrepresenting what happened 100% of the time.
Hahaha, are you saying that because it was you on the other end of that discussion? I know you love China so much that you are willing to praise their genocide of Uyghur people.
Maybe you could distill the theory for us a bit so we can decipher why "socialism" is producing hundreds of billionaires.
Not to my knowledge, but there's no way for anyone to know what incident it's referencing so it could be any conversation they had with anyone, or made up whole cloth. I say this exact thing every time I see someone claim something happened on the fediverse without providing a link 1 2 3, and I haven't been wrong yet. And that's not really surprising, why wouldn't someone provide a link to something that made the other side look bad, unless it didn't actually play out the way they claim?
For example, when you say that I "praise the genocide of Uyghur people," that is a lie, and it should be obvious that it's a lie from the fact that you didn't provide a link to it.
I'd be happy to have a good faith discussion regarding China's economic policies and how they relate to socialism. Just not with someone who I already know is going to lie, misrepresent whatever I say, and act in bad faith, as I know you will.
From the position of your acceptance of Uyghur genocide and pretending that China is anywhere near the left, it's astonishing you are comfortable accusing anyone else of bad faith.
There's simply no way to have a serious discussion with you regarding anything about China. That's why you have chosen the lemmy.ml instance, it is a hivemind of like thinkers all sheltered from the truth by fragile admins.
Oh, look at that, you can't provide a link. Because you're a liar. And once again my rule is proven true.
Oh, you want links? I can give you links.
Here you are linking to an article saying it isn't genocide: https://lemmy.world/comment/12211000
Here you are refusing to accept the genocide is happening despite a huge number of links: https://lemmy.world/comment/11959309
And as a bonus here's some trollish avoidance of admitting that the Tienanmen Square massacre happened: https://lemmy.world/comment/12256833
You do know there's a search function, right?
None of those links show me "praising" a genocide. That remains a bold faced, blatant lie.
Tbh, I find that this sort of casual lying is so common in spaces like .world that nobody even seems to care. Maybe it's a neurotypical thing, where you're allowed to tell lies so long as you're lying about the out group. Frankly, when people don't even acknowledge such things as lies, I have to wonder if they're even capable of being truthful or acting in good faith.
Those "huge number of sources" I actually went through point by point. Here's a book from the 1930's called 100 Authors Against Einstein which presents "a huge number of sources" claiming that Einstein's findings regarding General Relativity were wrong. Every one of them is wrong.
Also, I'm amazed that you'd link that last one as if it makes me look bad. The person was caught in saying something wrong so they abruptly pivoted to completely unrelated topics in the most textbook example of Whataboutism that I've ever seen in my life, so obviously I refused to indulge them.
Still waiting on a link for your original claim btw.
Also btw I think your first link is to the wrong comment.
Speaking of casual lying, this is what you were accused of:
You were not accused of praising a genocide even if you put that word in quotes.
Neither of these links show OBJECTION accepting a genocide.
Correct. They do not accept that there is a Uyghur genocide.
I don't feel like wandering your comment history looking for what you've had to say about China's treatment of Uyghurs. Unless you're not the same Objection I saw posting anime cartoons?
That's me.
I find it pretty convenient how you can so distinctly remember me praising something, but you can't remember anything else about that conversation that would allow you to find it in the search function. Are you sure we can rely on your memory? Because I don't remember ever saying that and I'm pretty sure I would.
Was this the same conversation where you were praising the Holocaust? I can't provide any evidence that that happened because I don't feel like wandering through your comment history, but I have a vague memory of you saying something like that, so I guess if vague memories are the standard of evidence we're relying on, you're looking pretty bad too.
Oh, we can solve that. I'll state for the record right now that the Holocaust is evil, rather than allow you to continue lying about that.
Will you say the same right now about China's treatment of the Uyghurs?
I will say right now that no genocide is praiseworthy, and that I have never praised any genocide in my life.
Right, you won't. You will prevaricate. You deny the China is doing anything to the Uyghur people, which is your form of supporting it. Thank you for proving me correct.
TIL all this time that I was calling myself an Atheist, I was actually praising God.
Might as well. You already praise a "socialist" China that objectively doesn't exist. AFAICT that religion you've subscribed to is the main reason you are denying the human rights abuses they are committing.
As I already said, I have no interest in explaining my positions or reasons to someone who is a blatant liar who I know is acting in bad faith and looking to twist around everything I say.
Yet here you were, a blatant liar, acting in bad faith, screeching and howling that I didn't bring you a link to your own support of Uyghur genocide. You should practice what you preach.
I haven't said a single lie. You have.
That's right! OBJECTION! is just a genocide denialist, like Holocaust denialists! Much better.
Genocide now has a very specific definition and there's no need to put "Uyghur genocide" in quotes like you're trying to deny it's really a genocide. It absolutely is.
Here's the definition, all it takes is for any ONE of these criteria to be met for it to be considered a genocide:
https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/en/ihl-treaties/genocide-conv-1948/article-2
"In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group."
So break this down for China's treatment of the Uyghur:
a) No. Not in, say, the same way Israel is executing Palestinians.
b) Absolutely. Forced imprisonment? Slave labor? Unquestionable.
https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/china-xinjiang-uyghurs-muslims-repression-genocide-human-rights
The Chinese government has imprisoned more than one million people since 2017 and subjected those not detained to intense surveillance, religious restrictions, forced labor, and forced sterilizations.
The United States determined that China’s actions constitute genocide, while a UN report said they could amount to crimes against humanity.
c) Yes, see above link.
d) Yes, forced sterilizations.
https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/22311356/china-uyghur-birthrate-sterilization-genocide
"In recent months, several Uyghur survivors have testified that the camps themselves have become sites of sterilization by injection, forced IUD implantation, and forced abortion."
e) Also yes.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-48825090
"China is deliberately separating Muslim children from their families, faith and language in its far western region of Xinjiang, according to new research."
So when you have 5 criteria for genocide, ANY of which are enough to qualify, and China's treatment of the Uyghur hits 4/5? Yeah, that's a genocide.
Im making this reply to help you better respond to people, not to start a fight:
Hey, just a heads up, your cfr link directly cites Adrian zenz, the person many people don’t trust to make even handed statements about China, directly twice.
The vox link sources statements from him several times. I tried to just quickly parse what was what but I came up with seven different statements.
The bbc article seems to reference zenz in six different claims.
I wasn’t able to give these articles a deep read, or check if the other sources also pull from that particular controversial figure or his organizations.
Lmao they banned @Objection for pointing out Zenz's bullshit
Why can't libs at least read the articles they link
here's hoping i showed enough civility to not catch a ban.