this post was submitted on 24 Oct 2024
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Ukraine cannot defeat Russia – the best the west can do is help Kyiv plan for a secure post-war future. (theconversation.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Dot@feddit.org to c/worldpolitics@lemmy.ca
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[–] PlasticLove 12 points 1 month ago (2 children)

What is this Kremlin garbage.

[–] Dot@feddit.org -2 points 1 month ago (1 children)

For most of 2024, Ukraine has been losing ground. This week, the town of Selidove in the western Donetsk region is being surrounded and, like Vuhledar earlier this month, is likely to fall in the next week or so – the only variable being how many Ukrainians will be lost in the process. Over the winter, the terrible prospect of a major battle to hold the strategically significant industrial town of Pokrovsk beckons.

[–] Carrolade@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago (1 children)

The Russians lost a whole shitload of ground in WW2, got pushed all the way back to Moscow. Same vs Napoleon's Grand Armee. Still won the wars.

[–] BrokenGlepnir@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago

More reason to give assistance to ukraine. Regardless of soviet propaganda, they did not do it alone.

[–] Dot@feddit.org -5 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I hope Ukraine stay independent and win this battle, but sadly that is not the reality.

The west is not helping it as they should.

[–] hydroptic@sopuli.xyz 6 points 1 month ago (1 children)

The west is not helping it as they should.

Exactly, and even pointing this out is liable to get you labeled as a Russian bot.

The political will to actually help Ukaine succeed is obviously not there, we're not doing enough, and we're now seeing the results. But let's stick our heads in the sand and pretend that anything negative is obviously "Kremlin garbage"

[–] Sidyctism2@discuss.tchncs.de 8 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

my issue with the artcle isnt that its poiting out the possibility of the ukraine losing (which is very real), but the suggestion of a "post-war ukraine", that might be able to better defend against russia.

to putin, winning this war doesnt just mean taking over some land, but the entirety of ukraine. if russia wins, best case szenario is they kick out and murder/ imprison the old government, and replace it with a puppet-regime, worst case they get rid of ukraine as a nation, absorb it into russia and annihilate anything ukrainian left (language, culture, ressentiments, opposition) by way of ethnic clensing.

if russia wins, there wont be a ukraine anymore.

[–] hydroptic@sopuli.xyz -1 points 1 month ago

You're assuming an "absolute" victory where they take over the entire country though, which doesn't seem too likely, instead of just Russia controlling some part of eastern Ukraine + Crimea, which wouldn't grant them total control over the rest of Ukraine