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Volodymyr Zelenskyy urges allies to stop just ‘watching’ amid North Korea threat
(www.theguardian.com)
this post was submitted on 02 Nov 2024
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It is highly unlikely North Korea will cross the Ukrainian border. Putin can let them do defense while Russians do the offense. As we have learned in the middle east, defending and enabling war criminals does not equate being complicit in their war. Don't ask me how that works.
So having western troops in Ukraine should also be fine if they stop at the russian border right?
We don’t want that
Who's "we"? Sounds like a proportionate response to me.
I wouldnt be presumptious enough to say we, but I would really prefer the war not escalate further. Im all in for ukraine, and definitely fuck east-ukraine, but I don't want American troops deployed in ukraine outside of advisory and training positions. I dont have great jusitifcations as to why, politics are hard, but I don't feel its the US' job to directly police the rest of the world, so Id prefer us to not directly combat other countries unless they've directly attacked us.
History certainly has a role to play here, which sucks because its always been my worst subject, but an eye for an eye seems to be at odds with peace which is obviously ideal. That is why I said my justifications arent great. It doesnt help that I do support foreign benevolent intervention, but not directly through force. And, as always, defining 'benevolent' in terms of an authoritarian regime engaging in foreign intervention of any kind is... difficult.
Edit: i forgot to mention: what we should be doing is allowing ukraine use of any non-warcrime western version of any weapon that east-ukraine is confirmed to use against them. We should also be quietly investing massive amounts of cyber resources into disabling russias nuclear launch systems and crippling putins stranglehold on their government by fucking with his finances specifically.
As the phrase goes, Si vis pacem, para bellum (If you want peace, prepare for war).
Russia doesn't care that you want peace. They don't care how nice you are. They care if they're going to lose. Putin wants power, and if he is going to lose that power he'll stop this war. There are many ways to do this, but I'm not opposed to NATO troops helping out. If Russia brings in foreign troops, that's more than enough justification for NATO to get more directly involved too.
We won't have peace by asking nicely. We'll have peace by ensuring an end to the invasion. If Russia wins then they'll continue. Ukraine winning is the only outcome that can bring peace.
The issue is that a direct war with russia would lead to the next world war guaranteed. It may not be nuclear, but it likely will. Even if it wasnt, an invasion of russia would be possibly the most difficult, drawn out, and costly war the US has ever faced.
I don't think so. I believe Russia would say that, but I don't think that is accurate. China likely wouldn't back them up because they'd have nothing to gain. They'd rather try to gain influence over whoever takes over after Putin.
I agree with you on preferring the US sending support to Ukraine in the form of equipment and strategic guidance instead of troops at this stage. European countries have a different balance of considerations due to their proximity to Russia, and I trust them to make the right choice on the level of support to provide.