this post was submitted on 28 Aug 2023
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Showerthoughts
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Yeah 100% When I joined I saw so much weird pro China and Russia comments, veiled but there. And no one would disagree! To me it felt like trying to influence newcomers and it was more insidious the way it was presented. Nothing like the dumb trolls I was used to seeing on reddit.
Yeah it's such a weird vibe here, and honestly, if it doesn't change, I think it's going to be what dooms the platform. This version of it, at least.
It's this super far left melting pot of western progressive talking points that are also somehow pro Russia and China.
Not saying that these are necessarily mutually exclusive views, but to most Western audiences, you're holding views that are (again within a Western frame of reference) simultaneously far right and far left...which is most likely to be polarizing enough to just annoy or piss off most casual users.
That's what was so fucking confusing to me. How can you go so far left that you are now praising current existing authoritarian governments that are hurting their own citizens and spreading it farther? Ukraine, Hong Kong, those are very fucking recent but even more shit happened in a lot of living memory with these countries.
Then I realized. They just chose the name far left. It sure as shit has nothing in common with what I believe a lot of us consider being left as; putting the well being of a citizen and social/environmental/etc progress above profit.
This is especially bad due to certain instances. It wasn’t so bad on Reddit where they usually limited themselves to a few subreddits, but it’s really off putting to see the nonstop propaganda they spew. So glad LW defederated with that instance.
Dude when I joined it was everywhere. I don't know if they were other instances or what because I was still learning the system and app I'm using (and app may not have even specified at the time everything was new) but I was HEAVILY considering leaving the site based on what I was seeing. And that .ml was run by ccp supporters. I saw completely unrelated subs (still don't know what to call them) even tho they were LW have in their rules no negative comments about CCP. They weren't even political subs. That's when I was like fuck it, I'm speaking up when I see it. I have people I care about directly impacted by this shit. I'm not tolerating it. Thankfully it is much better now at least on LW. idk about elsewhere
I had someone go off on me recently because I talked about how I never see the term "tankie" anywhere but on Lemmy.
I blocked them because they just became so fucking unhinged it wasn't worth responding to anymore.
I actually tried to find it in your history because I wanted to see how unhinged they got.
I am just going to gently say this, tankie rhetoric isn't really "politics" in the same way things can be in the west. They are praising, defending, and supporting governments that are hurting their own people to this day with authoritarian control and having citizens report their neighbors for any anti government speech or behavior.
I understand this is not a subject that everyone is aware of, especially with any nuance, so no judgement or anything I just wanted to elaborate in a kinder way than what you had. It isn't weird at all you have only seen tankie on here so far, and of course you're free to still be annoyed by it but please understand the context of why people are passionate about it! That's all. I am sorry you weren't treated with more tolerance though.
To some, it would sort of be like saying I don't care what isis is doing or that girls in the middle east can't go to school and honor killings are a thing in some places, cuz that's politics.
Wait. How is it not politics when it has to do with governments? Is there some kind of language barrier going on with the the term "politics"?
Yeah I didn't think it was weird either. But I don't appreciate sharing with people to have them throw it in my face.
so that's politics but not the tankie stuff that has to do with governments? This is the part that is like, really odd to me.
Hmm I think you misunderstood me! I was giving an example of other things that might also be interpreted a certain way if it was being discussed and you said you're not into politics.
So, I mean yes, literally all that is politics. In a casual conversational sense though people usually mean they don't follow the smaller stuff, elections and bills in congress and what the president is up to etc. Almost EVERYTHING is politics to some degree; gay marriage, education, drug use, mental health, wages, osha, privacy protection, healthcare, etc. When the context is about human rights violations/disenfranchise people it can come off cold and callous to say you don't care about politics, essentially that you don't care about people hurting. Especially online where the person you're talking to could not have the luxury to not care because it impacts them or someone they love. It may be more accurate to say you don't follow politics and so you were unaware.
I hope that clarifies my explanation better!
Yeah, there seems to be different definitions of politics going on here.
Yeah cause one is what it means literally and the other is what it means within the context of a social situation.
If we were in the middle of ww2 before America joined and you said you don't care about politics when the subject of the war and holocaust was happening people could naturally be upset and offended by that.
I mean, do you have any opinion at all on roe v wade being overturned?
yeah I wasn't a fan of that happening.
Me either. In fact I would be pretty confused and angry if I was having a conversation about how much it sucks and then someone chimed in that they don't care about politics. Confused and angry because don't they know people who this hurts? Realize that it's hurting children? AFAB who endured SA, including children??? Etc.
Now if someone said I don't pay attention to politics so I wasn't aware of it and I'm not aware of any nuance of why it's bad, that's more understandable. Ignorance vs potential lack of empathy. That's the difference between the two phrases and if you do care about some of these issues that happen to be political crosshairs rn, maybe now you can understand how that statement can be interpreted different ways based on context of the conversation and why you might want to adjust your phrasing if that is not the message you intended.
Does it make sense now?
I don't care anymore.
I'm sorry I was such a burden to you trying to answer your question that it warranted such a rude response.
Really, because to me you came off rude when it started coming across like this thinly veiled attempt to nitpick my choice of words.
I was explaining how and why one phrase may garner a negative reaction and assumption from some people which you continued to question, so I did my best to elaborate. And suggested another phrase that might express what you really mean better if you want to avoid having that reaction/assumption. It's up to you if you take it, it seemed you wanted to understand but got hung up on semantics of its all politics. I really didn't believe you don't actually care about any politics or that if you were aware of what's going on with why people hate tankies you would not find it important and shitty. So yeah I just tried my best but maybe as long as things don't directly impact you then it isn't worth thinking about or learning about?
I never attacked you and there was no veiled attempt or anything it all came from a place of compassion and you kept responding like you didn't understand so I did my best to explain the same point a different way while trying to address what you seemed confused about. I guess I see now you were just arguing with me. Idk maybe you are just a dick that doesn't care about other people if you don't know them. I can see now maybe your replies were arguments not a conversation.
No, you recognized there could be nuance in words and chose to nitpick anyway.
Maybe you just don't realize how condescending you came off as.
It was conversation until you condescended to me.
No, I really thought you were having trouble understanding what I was saying. Trying repeatedly to explain it in different ways is not being condescending when I really believe you didn't get it and needed more clarification.
Whatever you wanna believe though at this point I guess. I'm done. I don't like you and I think it's safe to say you don't like me.
Nah. You mentioned specifically what the different nuances for "I don't care about politics" but you chose to take me literally anyway.