this post was submitted on 10 Sep 2023
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My favorite part is when they lie to the president and Congress. Like, it's not enough that they do dogshit evil for the US government, they have to do dogshit evil against it as well? Is evil just the highest goal of the CIA? Is the agency just staffed with sociopaths?
... don't answer that, actually.
Letting the CIA develop a culture of criminality and invulnerability was a fucking mistake. Tear it down. Start over from the ground up.
If name a country where didn't work then you say "that wasn't real socialism" or it's the empire faults, always moving the goal post
Show one example where "socialism" didn't end in a dictatorship shithole.
That's easy - pretty much any government couped by the CIA.
Show me one example where a 'socialist' (including the mildest social democrat) government outside of maybe Europe was not continuously undermined, and if possible couped, by the agency in question.
Go huf your copium.
European countries, we has socialists policies, like national healthcare.
Show me one socialist country. No, USSR doesn't count, just the same way Nazis' "National Socialism" doesn't.
Yugoslavia?
Then by that debatable logic, we also have proof that democracy does the same thing since the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is authoritarian...
What? Please explain what the hell you are talking about. Just because you have "socialist" in your name doesn't make you anything social.
Behind the Bastards podcast has taught me that we will never fix the culture, will only sometimes remove individuals, and it will always be shitty.
Hey now, just because it can't be fixed doesn't mean it can't be better. The CIA is at a special level of dogshit. They can be less evil.
In theory, yes. In practice I can't imagine the political will exists to actually take down government-sanctioned criminal enterprises like the CIA. I think it would take something like a revolution to actually clean house at that level, and even that's a long shot because revolutions make things worse more often than not.
I think reforming the CIA from the ground up isn't impossible, though it'd require a great deal of political will. Going to punish the leaders though, that's probably a lost cause.
Are they not already less evil? All the stuff people criticize it about took place mostly 50+ years ago.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senate_Intelligence_Committee_report_on_CIA_torture
No. It's really not.
Ahhh yes, I had forgotten about that. Pretty evil shit.
Can that be done without negatively affecting their actual job of countering negative powers like Russia?
Yes, absolutely. The culture of criminality and invulnerability is not even helpful to their job. Running drugs to fund black sites where they torture people for shits and giggles is not actually in any way vital to the purported functions of the CIA. More oversight would do them good.
Unless you're asking if tearing it down and rebuilding it can be done without a period of reduced efficacy, in which case, no, that's a price that would have to be paid.
Nope. And their shenanigans killing some people isn't a problem on a bigger scale. They have done more good than evil and as long as it's a net positive its ok.
Jesus Christ
and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.
You can use this argument to justify any genocide.
Some people isn't a genocide, especially when its politically motivated. Your argument is just completely unrelated to the topic.
3 day old account. Lemmy.ee... Opinion rejected.
Yeah, I tend to agree. Especially now that Russia needs to be heavily contained.
They probably have done waaaay more good in the background but nobody notices because of the nature of it all. Russia isn't their only problem. China is more of a problem actually, Russia is just collapsing basically, the only thing to do there is gather intel and make plans to secure the nukes once their government fails (nobody needs Russian Warlords with nukes...)