Recently joined and started a community for people who want to move away from Lemmy and want to see Lemmy loosen its stranglehold on the threadiverse, if that seems like something interesting to you consider checking out !cancel_lemmy@piefed.social

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[–] lmmarsano@lemmynsfw.com 4 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (6 children)

Features

Nice things about PieFed:

Written in a common programming language that many developers understand and which has a bright future ahead of it. Python, of course! This will enable more contributions from a wider range of people than if it was made with Erlang, Ruby, Rust or PHP, for example.

Constructed in a simple and straightforward manner that new contributors can come to grips with quickly. No fancy algorithms, special design patterns, fragile build process, or front-end framework. Just Flask with sprinklings of vanilla JS and htmx.

Keep third party dependencies to an absolute minimum, to make server administration easier. Python + database (PostgreSQL) and you’re good to go! Redis optional.

Consume few resources, to make it cheap to run. Many examples of federated software are bloated Rube Goldberg machines that require hefty servers and serious server administration skills, making money a constant problem. PieFed instances will be small and nimble.

Emphasise trust, safety and happiness, drawing inspiration from the Mastodon Covenant.

Built to last using tried and true technology that will still work decades from now.

Differences between Lemmy and PieFed

Comments with -10 score are collapsed by default.

Communities are organized into topics. See https://piefed.social/topics.

Image-heavy communities can have a tiled/masonry view, like https://piefed.social/c/pics@lemmy.world

People who get downvoted a lot end up with a ‘low reputation’ indicator next to their name. You’ll know it when you see it.

Hide all posts based on keyword filters.

Keyboard shortcuts.

Upvotes in meme communities do not add to reputation.

Better UI design (somewhat subjective!)

Improved hotness ranking algorithm (subjective)

Voting is private.

See also features for healthy communities.

Each community has it’s own wiki.

Mastodon Covenant & "safe spaces" are overmoderated trash. Features for healthy communities consist of Reddity moderation tactics.

Heavy handed moderation is the main reason Reddit disgusts me, so no thanks, & fuck that shit.

[–] zonnewin@feddit.nl 9 points 3 days ago

Better UI design

Not from what I've seen.

I don't have a problem with Lemmy as software. I do wish the devs weren't tankies, but we don't have to engage with them.

[–] lambalicious@lemmy.sdf.org 4 points 3 days ago

[Features][features]

[Proceeds to list social credit features]

No thanks, if I wanted that I'd go to the CCP, Reddit, or Twitter.

[–] Draconic_NEO@lemmy.world 6 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (1 children)

Image-heavy communities can have a tiled/masonry view, like https://piefed.social/c/pics@lemmy.world

So what you're saying is that they have a ~~Social Credit~~ Karma system like Reddit does? I already hate it.

Upvotes in meme communities do not add to reputation.

Oh a really strict social credit system. Yeah fuck piefed for sure. It's already bad enough that people maliciously downvote comments on lemmy with alts, giving power to their votes will just make that shit worse.

As much as people give the Lemmy Devs shit they work hard to prevent this from happening on Lemmy, they removed the score API so people couldn't use Karma bots like Reddit does, they have a publicly exposed modlog so mod actions can be called out and critiqued (piefed has no modlog as far as I can tell). They may have their problems but Lemmy is a far better platform in terms of freedom and open-ness. Piefed is the real Reddit 2.0 complete with it's own social credit system, designed to make people with less popular opinions (or people at the mercy of downvote brigading) be ostracized.

[–] Quokka@quokk.au 0 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Those are all optional choices for instances.

So what you're saying is that they have a Social Credit Karma system like Reddit does? I already hate it.

Not that I'm aware of, members can see what percentage others vote (i.e. do you vote 100% downvotes?) but that's about it. Mods and admins can see a reputation metric, but that's not forward facing to the public and simply a way for bad faith actors to be flagged.

Upvotes in meme communities do not add to reputation.

You can set it on a per instance or community scale as to if votes count, if you only accept votes from your instance, etc. It's actually a really handy option to have, maybe you want a community for only local members to vote on policy etc, well now you can filter it so only they can vote in here.

(piefed has no modlog as far as I can tell)

Admins can turn it on/off, I've turned it on for my instance. https://quokk.au/modlog

[–] Draconic_NEO@lemmy.world 4 points 3 days ago

Admins can turn it on/off, I’ve turned it on for my instance. https://quokk.au/modlog

That's still not really much better. It should be on by default, the whole reason there's a modlog is for liability. Hiding the modlog isn't doing anyone any favors, don't try to tell me that there's merit to that. Obfuscation of mod actions is hiding them from accountability.

So what you're saying is that they have a Social Credit Karma system like Reddit does? I already hate it.

Not that I'm aware of, members can see what percentage others vote (i.e. do you vote 100% downvotes?) but that's about it. Mods and admins can see a reputation metric, but that's not forward facing to the public and simply a way for bad faith actors to be flagged.

Piefed puts weight on votes, the software punishes for being downvoted a lot. Therefore this is in a sense a social credit system. And it's made worse by the fact that you can exclude upvotes from counting but downvotes still count in there, so you can make it very difficult to earn ~~social credit~~ reputation but easy to lose it. That's not acceptable to me, that's worse than the environment on Reddit. This isn't a good thing.

[–] Kaboom@reddthat.com 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

People who get downvoted a lot end up with a ‘low reputation’ indicator next to their name. You’ll know it when you see it.

Software enforced echo chambers, as if it wasn't bad enough.

Everything else looks so good about piefed, sad to see a deal breaker like that.

[–] Draconic_NEO@lemmy.world 2 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Yeah this is like the worst feature of Reddit taken to the extreme by the ability to filter out upvotes from communities, but still allowing downvotes from those communities to hurt your score. I can't support a platform like that.

[–] Blaze@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 3 days ago (1 children)

I will check, but IIRC downvotes on ignored communities aren't accounted either

[–] Draconic_NEO@lemmy.world 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

That's not what it says in the building healthy communities section. It said that upvotes in "low quality communities" aren't counted but downvotes are.

[–] Blaze@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 days ago

@rimu@piefed.social, we might want to revisit this, maybe it would be more fair to discount votes on those communities altogether

[–] Draconic_NEO@lemmy.world 1 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Don't forget that admins can literally turn the modlog off on their instance to hide mod actions from others and who did them. How can anyone think that accountability limiting features is a good thing, especially coming from Reddit.

[–] Blaze@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (1 children)

As much as public modlogs are required, the lack of accountability of some mods repeatedly reported for power tripping makes me question sometimes if all of this is not in vain.

!privacy@lemmy.ml is still the most popular privacy community

!world@lemmy.world is still the most popular world news community

On the other hand, there are several features that Lemmy always ignored, and that exist on Piefed

consolidated comment view for all crossposts
actual instance blocking
multicommunities
keyword filters

[–] Draconic_NEO@lemmy.world 1 points 2 days ago (2 children)

As much as public modlogs are required, the lack of accountability of some mods repeatedly reported for power tripping makes me question sometimes if all of this is not in vain.

Maybe it seems that way since mods don't always or often yield to pressure on YPTB, but if there wasn't a modlog or if they could hide it and not announce actions publicly. We wouldn't even know. People would still complain about their bans but there would be no public evidence. No one could make a critical assessment based on the public evidence it would be the banned person's word against the mods. That's what a life without the modlog is, that's what it is on Reddit. I do not believe that real people want to go back to that. Server admins and mods maybe but not people.

On the other hand, there are several features that Lemmy always ignored, and that exist on Piefed

I believe the second, third, and possibly the fourth one are coming in later Lemmy versions.

[–] Blaze@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 days ago

https://piefed.social/modlog

Enabled and working

[–] Blaze@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

No one could make a critical assessment based on the public evidence it would be the banned person’s word against the mods.

I agree. I'll ask Rimu to enable the modlog on Piefed.social.

It just got enabled on https://piefed.world/modlog (so similar to https://quokk.au/modlog), it should appear in a few hours

I believe the second, third, and possibly the fourth one are coming in later Lemmy versions.

Let's talk again once they are here.

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