this post was submitted on 21 Sep 2023
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what does "conservatives" mean in poland?
Not to be mean, but in Poland's case it means: right-wing populists running on nationalism (we fight for you against the evil EU/Germans trying to destroy our country and against immigration) and retarded christian family values (anti-lbgtq, anti-abortion).
Going by your other reply: From an US perspective you should know the drill and what kind of conservatism is meant here.
what i tried to express elsewhere is "conservative" in the U.S. could mean something comparatively mild, like raise the kids, pay your bills, love your spouse, etc, all the way to violent fascism at the other end. so maybe the spectrum is like that in Poland, I don't know. I've heard some shit, but I don't know.
In this case it seems farmers. Maybe it's just posturing for appeasing them.
Extract from the Economist:
https://www.economist.com/the-economist-explains/2023/09/19/why-is-ukraine-suing-eastern-european-countries-over-grain
I always thought the goal was to bring down grain prices after getting choked from the war.
I am not sure I agree with Poland's outlook on the situation. Mainly because the goal was to feed people, not keep prices the way they were. And more grain was going to do that.
I understand Poland wanting to arm itself in a war with China or Russia, but I don't understand the reaction just because grain prices might go down because Ukraine is doing a great job of defending.
Then what was the point of Poland's assistance to Ukraine in the first place?
It might be just internal politics before an election.
There are two problems. The Polish government directed their farmers to increase output before this happened. And the Ukrainian grain that isn't allowed to be sold in Poland anyway (they adhere to EU minimum food standards, so they are not allowed to use Ukrainian grain in food production (it's produced for example with cheaper fertilizers and pesticides banned in the EU)) is finding it's way into Polish markets -illegally that is- and crashed the price.
They could address their issue about corruption and effective EU laws about food safety getting broken... or they could create a general ban (basically make something illegal that isn't legal in the first place) and spin a story about bravely defending their farmers from the EU (...from getting fucked over by their own corruption actually - but don't say that quiet part out loud).
It's election time and they are populists running on anti-EU narratives. So option 2 it is.
PS: Ukraine's government is also not blame-free here. Their grain should be transported through Poland, not be sold in Poland. So the public push back against a ban that isn't affecting that (transit is still allowed), should not generate such a reaction. They are either just stupidly over-reacting or -and that case would be even worse- complaining that they are not allowed to exploit Poland's internal problems to sell their grain there directly. Which is of course easier for them... but that was never the intention when allowing the transport of Ukrainian grain.
Or, just put the duty back on the duty free grain?
I am not polish but in Lithuania conservatives is a political party
I meant it as in "conservatives in other countries". Poland's ruling party is very much a conservative one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_and_Justice
sounds like the same bullshit as ohio. yay?
no shade intended, but in the U.S. it's a very vague term, and we have some loonies trying to latch on to that, as you might have heard
It is a very vague term. People just don't want to say ethno-nationalist socialist. Especially since those terms have been confused as well. It's a good smoke screen.