this post was submitted on 17 Dec 2023
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[–] Windows2000Srv@lemmy.ca 99 points 10 months ago (52 children)

Something that people should keep in mind is that the fees were lower for those "out-of-province" students in Québec than in their own province.

This fee raise basically brings it on par with what they would pay in their on province. One of the reasoning behind this law is that Québec shouldn't be subsidizing other provinces way too expensive university system.

If you are living in Québec, university fees are quite cheap, and this doesn't change.

The French vs English aspect is widely talked about, but not a whole lot is mentioned about the actual price hike.

[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 17 points 10 months ago (3 children)

The total fees for out of province students will still be lower than for out of province students in other provinces.

The fees for international students will still be lower than the fees for international students in other provinces.

In the only province where French is the only official language, French universities received less financing than English universities no matter the source, including from the provincial government. Donating to one's Alma Mater isn't part of the French Canadian culture for a ton of historical reasons, that leads to an university like McGill getting 200m$ from a single ex student and having over a billion sleeping in its coffers while the Université du Québec en Outaouais barely manages to offer basic services to its students.

Is it such a bad thing that the government asks that foreign students integrate themselves by learning the local language? That's an incentive for them to stay and it prevents the issue of having some of them stay without being able to speak the language, pretty much forcing them to live in one of three urban areas and their suburbs (Montreal, Gatineau, Sherbrooke).

[–] Marsupial@quokk.au 6 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Imagine calling your fellow countrymen foreigners.

[–] dlpkl@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago

That's just a taste of how badly Quebec's nationalists try to create a rift. But they'll be the first to turn around and tell you that Anglos are the problem.

Cambridge dictionary definition of foreign: belonging or connected to a country that is not your own.

[–] force@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

They are foreign though, literally. They are from a different province, plus a very different culture. There isn't much that separates someone from Alberta from someone from Montana or Massachussetts in that case, other than a passport.

[–] Marsupial@quokk.au 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

So?

My neighbour is of a different culture than me, yet I don’t think of them as a foreigner.

I could cross the state border and find someone of a different culture in a different state with different laws, they’re still not a foreigner.

[–] force@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

I mean you can Google the word "foreign" and the first thing that shows up is:

of, from, in, or characteristic of a country or language other than one's own.

of or belonging to another district or area.

And Wiktionary gives:

Located outside a country or place, especially one's own.

Originating from, characteristic of, belonging to, or being a citizen of a country or place other than the one under discussion. 

Most Québécois are primarily francophones, while the rest of Canada are anglophones, it checks that box. And obviously Québec is a different district/area than not Québec. And someome from outside of Québec is of course from a different place, both being a different province and a completely different sometimes almost unrecognizable culture.

Idk man seems pretty reasonable to call them "foreign" seeing as how they're from a different province. Plus "foreign" is a good catch-all word for anyone who isn't from the jurisdiction.

Also yes if you go into another state you are foreign to that state. Not foreign country-wise, but foreign state-wise.

[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 0 points 10 months ago

Heck, 100 years ago someone from four villages over was considered a foreigner...

[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 0 points 10 months ago (2 children)

See there's this thing we call "a definition" and that word is appropriate to the situation and if you think "foreigner" is pejorative then you're the one who's got an issue...

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[–] rivermonster@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Is it federally legal for to discriminate based on language? Don't know, don't live there, really curious, though.

Or is this one if those things that have to be adjudicated in the courts?

[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 10 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

The law states that English universities can take in whoever they want, 80% must finish their degree having reached conversational level in French otherwise English universities will lose part of their funding (when they're the universities that are the richest in the province).

That's not language discrimination, that's just bad journalism.

[–] rivermonster@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Thank you for clarifying. English is the official language of Canada, right? I know provences support French, but is it also an official language?

For instance, in the U.S. there is no national language. Most government forms are provided in MANY languages and/or can be requested in them.

I'm not sure in the US a university could require language profiency in a specific language. To be fair, though, I haven't researched it. Maybe somebody can clarify if there are any federally funded ones that do?

If Canadian universities require conversational French for 80% of grads but the only official language is English, then I wonder what the legal basis is for the requirement? If both English and Fench are official national languages, I understand how that would be the basis.

Thanks for the conversation, I'm learning a lot.

[–] independantiste@sh.itjust.works 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Canada has 2 official languages, French and English. Provinces can have their own official language and so in Québec it is french

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