this post was submitted on 06 Jan 2024
314 points (99.4% liked)

News

23406 readers
3370 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil


Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.


2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.


Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.


3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.


Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.


4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.


Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.


5. Only recent news is allowed.


Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.


6. All posts must be news articles.


No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.


7. No duplicate posts.


If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.


8. Misinformation is prohibited.


Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.


9. No link shorteners.


The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.


10. Don't copy entire article in your post body


For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] rivermonster@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

Lots of things, you never privatize critical services like water, electricity, and healthcare. And if you do privatize it, you do so with strong regulation.

You focus on worker co-ops and never allow a company to have less than 50% of the board of the directors made up of workers (see Germany), this helps prevent short-term vulture capitalism.

You never allow private business to capture the legislature and literally hand laws to the congress they own who blindly passes it, the main way things happen in a dystopia like Murica.

Just realized I'm likely feeding the troll.... you can do some reading, I've given you a starting place. You can Google democratic socialism as well, which might help as a general starting point.

[–] azertyfun@sh.itjust.works 3 points 10 months ago

Boeing and Airbus aren't really "regulatory capture" situations. They're basically state monopolies, and the EU and US have been suing each other for decades for unlawful competition lmao

Also they both have a HUGE defense sector that is completely tied to state policy.

Honestly the most capitalistic part about them is that everybody pretends that they're private companies operating in a free market (because that's a politically convenient lie in a neoliberal global economy), but that couldn't be further from the truth. Their Defense contracts are State-Funded, and their aviation R&D is State-Funded. De facto, I'd argue they are public companies.

Unfortunately part of Boeing's problem is that they are being slowly outcompeted by Airbus, but the U.S. government cannot let them fail. Not (only) because of corruption, but simply because Boeing's industrial capacity is crucial to the defense sector and cannot be allowed to perish or be sold off to a foreign competitor. That political reality exists independently of who sits at Boeing's board of directors, so changing it without doing anything about the politics might not yield appreciable results (at least not in the short term).

My take that the company should be officially nationalized and/or broken up, but both of those are political non-starters for the U.S.

[–] TheFonz@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago (2 children)

I'm not a troll but you're just rehashing things we all already agree on. Show us the roadmap to change beyond virtue signaling on message boards. Let's talk about more nuanced effective change rather than grandstand constantly with the same three topical catchphrase. I need more than "capitalism bad".

[–] wildginger@lemmy.myserv.one 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The next step is start voting for capitalism bad politicians.

Those politicians dont exist unless they think thats a platform that could get votes with.

They measure that by how much people talk about that and poll about that as a positive topic they support.

People dont poll about ideas they dont know or understand.

People learn and better understand political views by talking about them.

Unless youre asking for a violent revolution, this is how you start this conversation. By talking to people about it.

If you are asking for a violent revolution, thats your own bag. Thats not a step 2 to be egging other people into.

[–] TheFonz@lemmy.world -1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I'm not asking for a violent revolution. I'm asking for more meaningful discourse on Lemmy that doesn't start or end with "capitalism bad". All the stuff you said is nice, but not an actionable plan. You yourself don't seem very bought into it. Maybe we should shift the conversation less about the birds eye view and more about actionable items instead?

[–] wildginger@lemmy.myserv.one 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The actionable items are run for office, or vote.

Did you need me to tell you to vote? Are you wanting to run for office? No?

Then the actionable plan is show someone actually capable of holding office that this is a viable platform. So we have someone to vote for.

By talking about this. In public spaces.

I cannot repeat this more dumbed down for you.

[–] TheFonz@lemmy.world -1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

This is all so superficial as if we just woke up to politics yesterday. Are you running for office? What are you doing besides voting? Why don't you lead with that instead of this banal sophomoric rhetoric about capitalism? What about working towards meaningful policy change? Canvassing? Participating in local elections?

[–] wildginger@lemmy.myserv.one 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Do you think that the average person is getting directly involved in their local political scene?

Do you think people who are willing to engage with their local politics need to hear one last encouragement from a lemmy comment to finally push them over the fence?

Or do you think that the people who are informed and motivated enough to be involved already are doing that?

And that maybe, as a public forum, the actual best thing to be doing is making these ideas commonplace for the average person using that forum, so that when they see those ideas being advocated by someone running for office they will be familiar with the concepts and more willing to consider that person as a serious politician?

Or do you think maybe you know all this, and are just bitching because you want violence?

[–] TheFonz@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago

I think we need to do less grandstanding about how bad capitalism is and more encouraging people to participate in local elections and politics. I don't want violence at all.

[–] rivermonster@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I'm glad you're past capitalism bad. But it's a critical message that the majority don't get. For example, in the US we have two capitalist parties with nearly identical fiscal policies. There's no party to vote for that isn't the problem with respect to fiscal policy and economic principles.

Thus, one thing you can do is work on the people who don't understand all the problems we have that are the direct result of capitalism. Sharing information, helping them understand the linkages between their day to day struggles, and thst our system is literally the root of it.

Another is to join or found a labor union at your workplace. There is a lot of opportunity to organize and get people involved.

If you're more just looking for how to prepare for the likely collapse, there are groups like the SRS Socialist Rifle Association. There's every possibility that capitalism will collapse the US.

You can join a third party or the democratic local group around you and try to move their policies and stances to the left and away from capitalism. I personally don't have a lot of faith in the system atm. But I prefer anything to collapse and possible civil war.

You could even google this stuff yourself? I think I've been really generous on your "I'm angry, spoon feed me." If you don't mean it that way, then take it as constructive criticism.

[–] TheFonz@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I think what you don't realize is we're all past "Capitalism bad". So seeing the same goddam comment in every thread isn't helpful. It's actually turning people away from the cause. You don't need to spoon feed us anything, but you could lead with something more substantial. You really need to update your messaging.

[–] skulblaka@startrek.website 2 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I'm reading a lot of "you do" which is actually "your society should do" and which the average person has very little say in. I'm not going to be able to just march into congress and inform them that they are no longer allowed to deal with private businesses, no matter how much I may want to.