this post was submitted on 19 Feb 2024
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[–] HenryWong327@lemmy.ml 113 points 8 months ago (4 children)

The Youtuber Brandon F has a 4 part series talking about why they fought like this. Spoiler- it wasn't because they were stupid.

Part 1

TLDR- if you split up you just get run down by enemy cavalry.

Part 2

TLDR- a close formation lets you concentrate your firepower at one point.

Part 3

TLDR- a close formation makes communication and controlling the army much much easier (or even possible at all).

Part 4

TLDR- the formation makes the troops less likely to run away.

[–] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 62 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Fun (and short) read, the Manual of 1791, the gold standard of how to Infantry in the French army (translated): https://www.yumpu.com/en/document/read/62609125/french-drill-manual-1791

It's literally ALL marching and formation drills. How to not-shoot the guy in front of you, how to place your feet when firing, how to go from colums to line. Marksmanship isn't in there, bayonet practice isn't in there. None of the actual-killing-the-enemy was considered required knowledge, because the formation stuff was considered FAR more important.

And as a reenactor who has been clubbing in the back of the head with a musket more than I count (on account of being clubbing in the head a lot), this stuff really isn't as easy as it looks. The French might have had a YEAR to learn this at first, the latter recruits had a week.

[–] Shard@lemmy.world 34 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Ex-Military here.

Seems not much has changed. Unless you're a Tier 1 or Special Forces, you don't spend all that much time on marksmanship either.

Maybe 5-10% of actual training time goes to marksmanship. The rest of it is infantry skills. Squad level movement, field craft, field defenses, cover and concealment,urban ops, the list goes on. These are the things that win wars, not a 3rd Prestige COD pro.

[–] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 12 points 8 months ago (1 children)

These are the things that win wars, not a 3rd Prestige COD pro.

That's exactly my point. They learned what they had to know to win, just like today. And that generally isn't hitting a stationary target from a shooting table. And since nobody is training for that, it's hardly surprising they're not all that great at hitting stationary targets from a shooting table.

Nowadays, small-unit tactics and field ops win wars, back then, formation movement won wars. So that's what they trained, and as a result, they're not an army of sharpshooters. But they did win wars.

Yup.

What do you think would send a rag-tag group of fighters running, efficient use of ammo, or a regimented wall of firepower? Wars back then were won by breaking up the army so disease and desertion can take its toll, so you want your army as regimented as possible so you'll eventually win.

Look at the Revolutionary War, George Washington lost more battles than he won, but he knew defensive wars were won through attrition, not shooting more of your enemy. So he focused on disrupting supply lines and harassing the enemy (so more disease and attrition), not on direct confrontation. I imagine other musket-era wars were similar: if you have superior numbers, you break up the enemy armies; if you have fewer numbers, you disrupt enemy supply lines. In both cases, accuracy isn't important, strategy is.

[–] KeenFlame@feddit.nu 9 points 8 months ago (1 children)

... But they were also a little stupid

[–] ikapoz@sh.itjust.works 16 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Well, in the sense that knowingly going somewhere that’s likely to host crowds of people trying to kill each other is pretty stupid, sure.

[–] Rinox@feddit.it 2 points 8 months ago

Thank god we don't do that anymore ^/s

[–] Rodeo@lemmy.ca 3 points 8 months ago (2 children)

TLDR- a close formation lets you concentrate your firepower at one point.

Can't they just all aim at the same spot no matter where they're standing?

[–] Anamnesis@lemmy.world 14 points 8 months ago (1 children)

They only had a range of like 50 yards. Split your troops up and they can't aim at the same point because they wouldn't all have the range to hit it.

[–] Rodeo@lemmy.ca 1 points 8 months ago

I mean you can still have guys standing further apart than shoulder to shoulder. 50 yards is still something to play with.

[–] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 1 points 8 months ago (1 children)

On a vast featureless plain, yes. But you won't be overly surprised to learn most battles were fought over some form of terrain, and not a mathematics textbook.

[–] Rodeo@lemmy.ca 1 points 8 months ago

I thought line of sight would be an exceedingly obvious requirement, but I suppose some people need it spelled out for them.

[–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 1 points 8 months ago

Ok but doesn't explain why they're all standing straight up