this post was submitted on 25 Feb 2024
1293 points (92.7% liked)
libertarianism
396 readers
1 users here now
About us
An open, user owned community for the general disscussion of the libertarian philosophy.
- Libertarianism is the belief that each person has the right to live his life as he chooses so long as he respects the equal rights of others.
- Libertarians defend each person’s right to life, liberty, and property.
- In the libertarian view, voluntary agreement is the gold standard of human relationships.
- If there is no good reason to forbid something (a good reason being that it violates the rights of others), it should be allowed.
- Force should be reserved for prohibiting or punishing those who themselves use force.
Most people live their own lives by that code of ethics. Libertarians believe that that code should be applied consistently, even to the actions of governments, which should be restricted to protecting people from violations of their rights. Governments should not use their powers to censor speech, conscript the young, prohibit voluntary exchanges, steal or “redistribute” property, or interfere in the lives of individuals who are otherwise minding their own business.
Source: https://www.libertarianism.org/essays/what-is-libertarianism
Rules
1. Stay on topic
We are a libertarian community. There are no restrictions regarding different stances on the political spectrum, but all posts should be related to the philosophy of libertarianism.
2. Be polite to others and respects each others opinions.
Be polite to others and respects each others opinions. We don't want any form of gatekeeping or circlejerk culture here.
3. Stay constructive and informational
In general, all types of contributions are allowed, but the relevance to this community must always be evident and presented openly by the contributor. Posts that do not meet these requirements will be removed after a public warning. Also remember to cite you sources!
4. Use self-moderation measures first before reporting.
This community is fundamentally built upon freedom of speech. Since everyone understands libertarianism differently and we do not want to exclude any kind of content a priori, we appeal to the individual users to block/mute posts or users who do not meet their requirements. Please bear this in mind when filing a report
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Read the Cuckoo's Egg from 1989. NSA were at the very least tapping all international calls in the 1980s.
The people that cared knew about this for a long time.
All Snowden did was give up sensitive intel to foreign adversaries and got NSA capabilities that anyone that cared already knew about talked about more in the media.
And nothing has really changed. There's no international law against this so there's nothing preventing Russia and China from looking at your data. There's also nothing prevent five eyes countries from spying on each other's citizens and sharing it back with the country whose citizens they spied on. Do you feel better that the NSA is spying on Canadians while Canadians spy on US citizens and the two countries exchange what they have on each other's citizens?
They would have all data that any company has about you that has been sold to a marketing company. It's trivial to create a shell company posing as a ad agency and legally buy all that data. And given the enshittification of everything there is data on basically everything you do. You buy groceries with a loyalty card? It's on an NSA database being analyzed by an AI for suspicious activity. You didn't read the fine print when you got that loyalty card that said they would share the data to third parties? It means the data will be shared to anyone that's willing to pay them for it, and that includes the NSA. Why do you think they were giving you that discount? Because they're nice? Nope, it's because they can sell your data.
This is happening because it's the job of the NSA to gather data for intelligence purposes. They will sponge up any data they can legally obtain. And if you agree to data being shared with third parties, you've agreed that the data can be shared with the NSA. So it is.
So now you understand that the NSA is likely doing these things because they can, do we need another traitor to hand over classified data to foreign adversaries to make you aware of it?
but then,
Government doing it in secret vs a citizen exposing it? I'm going to back my fellow citizen in this one.
That's some serious bootlicking there, you think they're only collecting "legally" obtained information? Let's also gloss over the anti-consumer practices that companies employ to obtain that sweet third party data on you.
"you’ve agreed that the data can be shared with the NSA. So it is." - JFC you have some weird logic going on in your head. Let's just forget what's required in today's society, the data that has to be shared to perform basic functions like employment now adays. The average citizen is not a privacy expert and no one is educated in K-12 to be consensual informed.
Your "fellow citizen" is a citizen of Russia. Ya think he's going to expose all the data collection Russia is doing? LOL
Indeed. Everyone glosses that over because it's considered acceptable for every scumbag marketing person to know everything about you so they can manipulate you into buying shit you don't need. That's fine as long because you're too paranoid over the NSA to give a shit about the fact that privacy doesn't even exist anymore. You're data is so boring to the NSA it gets filtered out with one pass of an algorithm. The marketing companies are data mining the shit out of your data.
There's no such thing as privacy now, the only thing Snowden accomplished was compromising intel which Russia rewarded him for. Dude is a straight up traitor.
I just spent the entire time reading this just aghast at the audacity for you to voice an opinion like this in 2024, with rising fascism throughout the world.
How deeply under a rock must your mole-hill have been built, how jingoistic and nationalistic must one become to have such... such a collosally naive take? I am so angry with you right now.
Yeah and where is a lot of the propaganda promoting fascism coming from? The country where your hero Edward Snowden lives and is now a citizen of?
How much data do you think Russia is collecting about you? How much data are they collecting on their own citizens? Do you think Snowden is brave enough to blow the whistle on that kind of activity happening in the country he's currently a citizen of?
Who is the one really living under a rock here?
I thought i had blocked you? I've already looked thru your history you fuckin venal little turd. Don't ever conflate the fact we accidentally spoke with thinking you ever deserved my attention.
I don't think it was feasible at the time (2013) for the average American to know and understand the concept that their government was capturing essentially all mobile cellular and internet communications for storage and analysis in giant fusion centers.
The real tragedy is that many people now know and still don't care, or have given into this bizarre cynical defeatism that we might as well just accept it. Hard disagree on those points.
Any US intelligence agency or military unit operating on US soil against US citizens is supposed to be illegal.
That is law enforcement's territory.
yup