249
China wants to rid itself of Western tech by 2027 -- outlines domestic alternatives in 'Document 79'
(www.tomshardware.com)
this post was submitted on 11 Mar 2024
249 points (98.4% liked)
World News
39041 readers
2689 users here now
A community for discussing events around the World
Rules:
-
Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
- Post news articles only
- Video links are NOT articles and will be removed.
- Title must match the article headline
- Not United States Internal News
- Recent (Past 30 Days)
- Screenshots/links to other social media sites (Twitter/X/Facebook/Youtube/reddit, etc.) are explicitly forbidden, as are link shorteners.
-
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
-
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.
-
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
-
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19
-
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
-
Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
-
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
Lemmy World Partners
News !news@lemmy.world
Politics !politics@lemmy.world
World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world
Recommendations
For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/
- Consider including the article’s mediabiasfactcheck.com/ link
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Let’s cut through the noise here. The idea that China has been playing 4D chess while the West plays checkers is a sexy narrative, but it misses the forest for the trees. Yes, China has masterfully leveraged the existing global system, pulling itself up from the economic bootstraps with a mix of state-driven capitalism and strategic engagement with Western technology and markets. This isn’t a con; it’s smart strategy, plain and simple. They saw an opening in the global market’s hunger for cheap labor and pounced, all while Western companies tripped over themselves to cut costs and boost quarterly earnings. Exploitative? Perhaps. But a con game? Hardly. Both sides knew what they were getting into; it was a marriage of convenience where both parties shared the bed for mutual benefit.
Now, onto this doomsday prophecy about the U.S. spiraling into oblivion. If you’re betting on American collapse, you’re going to lose your shirt. The U.S. isn’t just standing; it’s adapting and moving in ways that the naysayers seem to conveniently overlook. Post-COVID, the stats tell a story not of decline but of rebound and resilience. Unemployment’s in check, inflation fears are being managed, and domestic consumption is through the roof. Americans are spending, industries are innovating, and energy? The U.S. is sitting on an energy bonanza that makes the Middle Eastern oil sheikhs blush. Thanks to shale, the U.S. is not just energy independent; it’s a global energy heavyweight.
And let’s not forget technology. Silicon Valley isn’t just a place; it’s a global beacon of innovation. AI, biotech, quantum computing—you name it, the U.S. is at the sharp end of the spear. This innovation engine isn’t sputtering; it’s accelerating, fueled by a demographic dynamism that much of the developed world can only dream of, thanks largely to immigration.
As for Europe, casting it as the West’s last bastion against a rising China misses the point. Europe has its cards to play, sure, but don’t count the U.S. out of the game. The American economy is a behemoth, driven by internal markets, technological supremacy, and demographic vitality. Europe’s integration and strategic coherence are worth watching, but let’s not pretend it’s the only show in town.
In sum, the narrative that China’s rise comes at the expense of a declining West, and particularly a faltering U.S., is overly simplistic and frankly, wrong. We’re in a period of massive global transition, sure, but the American decline? That’s not the story being written. The U.S. is shifting gears, and the next chapter might just surprise the gloom-and-doom crowd.
I don’t necessarily believe the United States will collapse, but we can already see that it is becoming an increasingly unreliable partner that basically flip flops on all positions depending which party is in control. They are also seemingly weary of their role as global hegemon, adapting a more isolationist and inwards oriented position.
This doesn’t mean that the u.s. will break down completely, but I could see some secessionist nonsense happening in the near future, or the looming slip into religious fascism. The country has massive internal problems that hamper its ability to maintain its role as global player, aside from their direct interests.
The thing is, American politics is inherently cyclical. Yes, it’s a rollercoaster with the parties flipping policies like burgers at a BBQ, but that’s the beauty of it. This isn’t weakness; it’s the vibrancy of democracy in action. It creates a resilience, a kind of institutional elasticity that’s unique.
Now, about the U.S. pulling back from the world stage—it’s not so much isolationism as it is recalibration. America’s geography, its energy independence—these are cards other countries can only dream of. This allows for a shift in priorities without losing global influence. The world’s changing; the U.S. is just adjusting its sails, not abandoning the ship.
Talk of secession, extremism—it’s eye-catching, sure, but let’s not get carried away. The U.S. is facing challenges, absolutely. Polarization, debates on its identity and role globally, these are serious. But remember, the U.S. has navigated through civil wars, major economic depressions, and profound social changes. It’s not just going to crumble.
In this global game, where uncertainty seems to be the only constant, the U.S. remains a key player. It’s picking its battles, sure, but when it steps onto the field, it plays to win. The essence here is not about a retreat but a strategic pivot. The world’s a complex place, and the U.S., with all its debates and divisions, is still right at the heart of it, making moves that count.
Great non-ideological analysis.
I predict serious problems with the US economy if wealth inequality and housing affordability are not addressed. Those are the biggest problems and US leadership doesn’t seem to even want to address them.
The con was that the western companies gave over some serious IP for a decade or maybe 2 of cheap manufacturing. China was trying to industrialize for decades and essentially couldn't do it. Walk in the western companies and they gave all the knowledge, skill, everything ($$$$) for some cheap labour ($).
Western companies think 5 years is a long term plan, so they'll take whatever terms for 5 years (mayyybe 10 if they are unheard of long term planning) and after that is ????, but profit-now-is-everything-by-definition. But China is playing decades at a time, they are getting decades, close to a century of IP, for next to nothing in the big picture.
Yes, china got some leapfrog effect, but tech isn't static. And they are going to hit a wall with AI in particular because of the rampant censorship they cling to for no good reason.
We have seen this play out before. The closed down, autocratic paradigms lose out to the open, permissive ones. If America ends up in decline it will be because Christian nationalists fucked it all up, but it's not going to make China more powerful. The only way for China to become powerful is to liberalize.
That's not what leapfroging is. Leapfrogging is skipping over technology EG skipping over land lines and going to cell phones. That does happen but that wasn't what I was getting at. What I'm getting at is they took in serious serious IP and industrial knowledge. They took in, this is a bit of hyperbole just to get the point across, a century of IP in exchange for some cheap labor for a couple decades. That's how short-sighted Western companies are. (A few decades overall, but for any specific company contract they would get the IP in 5 to 10 years.)
Nor did I suggest that they're closing down. You're simply off the mark on that. I don't think the other guy suggested that either, but I didn't address it. They want to sell to Africa, South America, etc.