this post was submitted on 12 Mar 2024
314 points (97.9% liked)

News

23406 readers
4540 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil


Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.


2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.


Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.


3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.


Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.


4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.


Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.


5. Only recent news is allowed.


Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.


6. All posts must be news articles.


No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.


7. No duplicate posts.


If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.


8. Misinformation is prohibited.


Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.


9. No link shorteners.


The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.


10. Don't copy entire article in your post body


For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

I don't think the browser version saves drafts?

It just happened again and I'm seriously considering quitting lemmy due to it. What a shit feature. Even up voting or down voting a post destroys your comment box.

The gist of it was that SF has been setting its own housing goals artificially low, and that you should reframe your thinking from "people left but rent prices didn't go down" to "people left and rent prices stopped rising". I had sources etc. I also criticized your source for "why more housing is bad" for being the leftist version of Fox News, all hot takes with no substance, designed to manipulate people and harmful to society.

Edit1: here's a good source for actual, realistic (in the sense that it matches the demand) home building goals: https://www.hcd.ca.gov/about-hcd/newsroom/state-releases-accountability-report-on-san-franciscos-housing-policies-and-practices

If San Francisco’s current rate of housing approvals and construction continues, the City will miss its housing production goal of over 82,000 new homes by 2031 that is necessary to address affordability and overcrowding challenges experienced by the current population, as well as providing homes for future San Franciscans. San Francisco must add over 10,000 new homes, including over 5,800 affordable homes, each year. So far in 2023, San Francisco has permitted less than one home a day.

Essentially, SF was blocking so much housing that the state stepped in.

Edit2: the article you linked is the worst kind of falsehood, an intelligent one.

A simple falsehood is lies: "the election was stolen". Quantifiably untrue.

A slightly more complicated falsehood has elements of truth: "the DNC stole the election from Bernie". Not exactly true, but the true parts give a shield for the unspoken overall implication.

The article you linked is what I like to call a Tier 3 Falsehood: one that acknowledges the flaws in a position, pretends to be on your side, and then skillfully manipulates you into a position supporting the very flawed argument that it led with. A reverse cargo cult is the classic example: https://hanshowe.org/2017/02/04/trump-and-the-reverse-cargo-cult/

I don't think this article is as insidious as reverse cargo cults. I think it's just a NIMBY using the standard NIMBY tactic of trying to justify their own self-interest and throwing every argument they can at you to see what sticks. But it's clear half-truths and manipulations, to the point that while you started the article hating NIMBYs, you ended supporting them and aren't quite sure why.

In a nutshell, it's because the article is a mix of excellent arguments built on shaky premises, and traditional tribalist associations.