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326

Ukraine war: We have no Plan B if Ukraine falls, Estonian PM says (www.bbc.com)

submitted 5 months ago by MicroWave@lemmy.world to c/world@lemmy.world

62 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Estonia considers itself a front-line state, a Nato member where its border guards stare across the Narva River at the Russian fortress of Ivangorod.

This tiny Baltic state, once a part of the Soviet Union, is convinced that once the fighting stops in Ukraine, President Vladimir Putin will turn his attention to the Baltics, looking to bring countries like Estonia back under Moscow’s control.

To help stave off that possibility, Estonia’s government has poured money and weapons into Ukraine’s war effort, donating more than 1% of its GDP to Kyiv.

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[–] cygnus@lemmy.ca 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

stop spreading Russian disinformation

WTF? I sincerely don't understand why you're so averse to what I'm saying. I'm not anti-NATO by any means — I'm only stating a fact that I thought would be very cut and dry.

https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_110496.htm

With the invocation of Article 5, Allies can provide any form of assistance they deem necessary to respond to a situation. This is an individual obligation on each Ally and each Ally is responsible for determining what it deems necessary in the particular circumstances.

This assistance is taken forward in concert with other Allies.** It is not necessarily military** and depends on the material resources of each country. It is therefore left to the judgment of each individual member country to determine how it will contribute. Each country will consult with the other members, bearing in mind that the ultimate aim is to “to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area”.

At the drafting of Article 5 in the late 1940s, there was consensus on the principle of mutual assistance, but fundamental disagreement on the modalities of implementing this commitment. The European participants wanted to ensure that the United States would automatically come to their assistance should one of the signatories come under attack; the United States did not want to make such a pledge and obtained that this be reflected in the wording of Article 5.

[–] nahuse@sh.itjust.works 1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Where does it say it’s voluntary?! And, again, you need to take it in line with literally every other treaty in effect, which emphasizes the ways that defense works.

It can’t be automatic because US domestic laws prohibit the president from declaring war without congressional approval, not because taking part in a defensive pact is somehow optional. And, again, sovereignty is baked into all international laws, especially those having to do with the United States (it’s always been really serious about maintaining this more or less absolutely).

You’re stating a “fact” that’s incorrect, and works in the interest of countries that would benefit a great deal from a lack of adherence to Article 5. Stop it. If any country decided to not participate when Article 5 is invoked, the alliance would end. It’s quite literally the cornerstone of the whole deal.

Edit: I went ahead and found another source that explains what I have been saying: https://www.jstor.org/stable/resrep10238

What the action is, is indeed ambiguous, not the requirement to take action, which is not.

[–] cygnus@lemmy.ca 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I truly hope you're right! I'm doubtful, but I do hope so.

[–] nahuse@sh.itjust.works 1 points 5 months ago

You should trust the words of experts, then, and make sure that you put pressure on your government to adhere to the text of the treaty rather than trying to inject doubt about it.

https://www.jstor.org/stable/resrep10238