150
meme (lemmy.world)

just noticing a lot of very principle anti-genocidists very suddenly changing their focus, it is almost as if some pattern can be discerned through ignoring their statements and watching their behavior

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[-] Honytawk@lemmy.zip 4 points 5 days ago

The thing is that Trump is even more of a geriatric, and actively endorses genocide. On top of all of his other bullshit.

Yet it is only a problem when the Democrats do it.

[-] Skates@feddit.nl 4 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

It's not only a problem when democrats do it. It's a problem when democrats begin doing it as well.

Look man, I'm not from your country, but it's clear this is the same thing that's been happening now all throughout Europe. Where there are usually more than two choices, so we can't even claim lack of choice as the reason. Let me try to explain.

Old parties have been around the block so many times, everyone knows how morally corrupt they are. "Lesser of two evils" is not something younger voters want to go for. They want a party that represents them, and none of the old ones want to represent them. They just want the power, but not to speak the will of the voters. And while some are obviously bad choices (like your Republicans), the leftist voters are especially mad at those parties that have been masquerading as socialist or left-leaning. Because they promised and didn't deliver. Just like your Democrats.

So now all throughout Europe there are newly established far-right parties getting a bunch of votes, on the basis of "nobody else is keeping their word, or representing me as a voter, so I might as well try these new guys". Trump won his first election on that platform, and he'll win the second election on the same grounds.

But this isn't a problem with the voters. For example, Germany now has this exact situation. Who do you think most voted for the new far-right party? The eastern part of Germany. The poorest part, with the fewest job opportunities, with the lowest incomes, the highest frequence in homelessness, the least educated etc. And who's to fucking blame for an entire class of people being disenfranchised over several decades? The voters?

Nah, man. The only ones who made this bed are the parties who created today's environment. Usually we sleep in it, but every now and then people get tired of getting fucked, and they force a change, even if it may be a bad one. And sometimes, that is enough - the knowledge that even if you lose, at least the people who have been actively hurting you also don't get to win. They lose as well, they sleep in the same bed as you for a change. At least this one fucking time.

I won't deny that it's a destructive mentality and that it may lead to long-term negative effects that are hard to undo. But this has moved past a reasonable situation for some. Desperation kicks in, and the need for revenge is strong. When you work 2-3 jobs to feed your kids, when you can't sleep at night because you don't know if tomorrow you're gonna be evicted while you're at work, when you can't afford basic necessities... Fuck it, man. You get it. Sometimes you just desperately want things to change and you don't care if the world burns in the process, because your world has been burning for god knows how many years, and nobody seemed to care so far. And at that point, you're especially pissed at those who pretended they cared.

[-] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 points 5 days ago

You think there's a lot of Trump supporters around here that need to hear it or something? I guess you'd have to go to trumpsocial or whatever they call whatever site they congregate on to talk to them, but plenty of ardent Biden stans are here to hear the Biden hate.

Biden stans are also seen by most of his detractors here as simply misguided, not entirely lost causes. You can likely surmise they think the exact opposite of trump supporters, who mostly around here would get stuff like "kys" instead.

You can say what you want about their politics, but the prevalence of Biden memes and the lack of Trump memes is logical for those reasons and likely more, as another commenter said you can only clean your own house and all.

[-] eldavi@lemmy.ml 4 points 5 days ago

Yet it is only a problem when the Democrats do it.

you can clean your own house the way you want; but not other people's houses.

[-] jorp@lemmy.world 1 points 5 days ago

Yes it's true the left supports Trump. The American political binary has rotted your brain. It's time for ALL Americans left of fascist to demand more from both parties. Democrats are the ones clutching defeat from the jaws of victory election after election.

[-] agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works -2 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

The time to demand more isn't 4 months before the election. It's not really the year of the election. The time to demand more is 10+ years before the election, supporting better candidates in smaller elections, rallying behind those candidates as they climb the ladder, and supporting those candidates right after the last election before the one you want them to win.

But I don't see that. I see no more than a slim minority doing any demanding until the last minute, when it does more harm than good.

[-] jorp@lemmy.world 4 points 5 days ago

Progressive Democrats are primaried out by AIPAC funded pro genocide liberals and you put the blame on progressives.

Liberals need to realize they're not entitled to the left's support without some effort and cooperation on their side.

Your party are blue conservatives, clean up your own shit.

[-] agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works 1 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

I'm not a Liberal, they're not my party. They are the party out of the two front runners which is more aligned with my interests than the other.

The left needs to realize it's not a matter of entitlement, it's simple game theory harm reduction. The environment in which you pursue leftist goals will be predominantly colored by the winner in November. You can enable an environment which is unfavorable to leftist empowerment, or extremely unfavorable to leftist empowerment.

Would you rather try to push progressive action under Biden, or Trump? I personally believe progressive action will be more successful under Biden than Trump, so I will be voting accordingly. Blue conservatives are better for leftists than red fascists.

this post was submitted on 02 Jul 2024
150 points (72.9% liked)

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