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[Spoiler C3E61])Taliesin Jaffe discusses the Critical Role's Bells Hells live show, exploring Ashton's origins, feelings about FCG, and the aftermath of Sword-gate. Critical Role's Bells Hells Live Show will take place on June 15th at The Greek Theatre. The livestream will be available on Thursday, June 20th, with the VOD on Monday, June 24th. Read our full interview and article here
2024 has been an impressive year for Critical Role, with the launch of Beacon, the Candela Obscura live show, the upcoming Bells Hells live show at the Greek Theater, and the highly anticipated third season of The Legend of Vox Machina on the way. In 2023, the heroes of Campaign 2, The Mighty Nein, reunited, and a new circle of tragic heroes came together during the Candela Obscura live show in May. However, this will be Critical Role's first live show featuring the third campaign with Bells Hells in Aeor continuing their quest to defeat Ludinus and save Exandria. The Bells Hells live show will be the 98th episode in the current campaign, with Robbie Daymond joining the main cast on their adventure through Aeor. Brennan Lee Mulligan will also make an appearance, serving as the Master of Ceremonies. Bells Hells are in a difficult place, with the loss of one of their own still hanging over their heads and tensions rising as interparty conflicts reveal disturbing truths about others. They will need to put their differences and grief aside in order to save all of Exandria from the machinations of Ludinus as he tries to wipe out the Gods once and for all. Screen Rant interviewed Taliesin Jaffe about the upcoming Critical Role Bells Hells live show. He discussed how playing in front of an audience changes their approach, how it feels to play at the Greek Theater, and reflected on the Candela Obscura live show. Jaffe also discussed Ashton's origins, how Ashton is feeling in the wake of losing FCG, and why Ashton was so sympathetic towards Laudna in the wake of Sword-gate.
Jaffe shared his disbelief about playing D&D at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, especially in the wake of playing at the United Theater on Broadway for Candela Obscura. He also shared his excitement about being able to experience these amazing venues from behind the scenes.
Taliesin Jaffe: "A little ridiculous. Very ridiculous. Anytime we do a live show, it feels a little ridiculous. I love Los Angeles so much. I love living here. The Ace Hotel for Candela was amazing, and just going in for [The Greek], yeah, go again. Let's hit another amazing, amazing venue that I cannot wait to see the backstage of and run around and be a problem."
Jaffe also discussed what goes into the preparation for a live show. Jaffe revealed that he focuses on his costume and tries not to think too hard about playing in front of so many people. He also explained how playing in front of an audience impacts the play style, from cutting back on crosstalk to how they are able to look at each other down the table.
Taliesin Jaffe: "For us, other than a costume, A figuring out what we're going to wear, which takes surprising amount of time, and then once we've kind of decided what the theme is going to be, then our poor stylist, Jenny Newman, goes and tries to collect as many bits and pieces as possible and throw it together for us. Honestly, I will say personally, I just try and not think about it too much until it's far too late and just sort of pretend it's going to be yet another episode of the game and not get too caught up.
Playing it, there's a few differences. Got to be a lot more careful about crosstalk and also occasionally holding for audience and the weirdness of having a microphone in your head and playing it kind of an angle, which is always a little weird. So a lot of that [leaning over to look down the table]. The crew on the other hand is going crazy the entire time. They're going mad and working really, really hard to make it seem like nothing terrible happened. Occasionally there is utter chaos backstage and no one would know. It'll be fine. That's what they say anyway."
Jaffe reflected on the experience of bringing The Fairelands to life in the United Theater. He looked back on the audience's interactivity and his hope to explore that more in the future. He also shared a bit of behind-the-scenes insight about how he was preparing his monologues as the Master of Ceremonies.
Taliesin Jaffe: "For me anyway, or in talking to the cast and everyone. It was the fact that we'd never really done anything quite like that before. The interactivity, of course and the actual between the acts and before the show with a little bit of storytelling happening outside of the main performance and a little bit of interactivity. We were hoping it was going to go really well. I'm quite pleased asking the audience to kind of dress up and be part of it.
Definitely because it was sitting outside of the normal style of game and the normal play. It was interesting writing all of the opening and closing speeches. I think I was writing until about two minutes before the opening of the show and then probably up until the last 60 seconds of the end of the show. There was a plan to just print it out on paper. I'm like, That's not happening. Still typing. Sitting going, Spenser, you better kill somebody. I swear to God this is getting rough.
Yeah, figuring out how, having a stage where the actors could move around. There were so many interesting things actually, like playing with character creation that day. There were just multiple interesting angles to it. Those were big ones for us anyway. The crew always has their own."
Jaffe also shared his favorite story about bringing the Fairelands to life for the audience. He revealed another aspect of audience participation that went beyond what was seen on stage or screen.
Taliesin Jaffe: "My favorite story. One of our actors came over and was trying to get information out of one of the audience members and their friends kept trying to get them to come to their seats. And apparently the audience member said, Go away. I'm trying to narc. I look forward to trying to top that. That's our goal."
Jaffe explained how pacing is impacted by the live audience and how they need to be mindful of accommodating both the people watching in the theater and the fans who will be watching it at home. He also discussed the adrenaline rush that comes from being on stage and how it is less intimate than playing in their studio.
Taliesin Jaffe: "To actually try and apply the things that we learned rather than just notice them and then ignore them. That's tough to say. The big one is always pacing, it's so easy to keep tempo with each other when we're at the normal table that just getting into the technical aspect of having a audience and the adrenaline rush, which is intense.
The just technical aspects of sitting that way of just trying to maintain the tempo so that not just the audience enjoys it, but people who are watching later who have to deal with the slightly slower tempo of a game, and much less intimate obviously as well. But I think we are getting more and more comfortable doing it, although the adrenaline has not gone away yet."
Screen Rant: "Yeah, I don't think it's going to go away."
Taliesin Jaffe: "The Greek, oh God no. I don't even know."
Critical Role recently launched Beacon, their own special membership service that is the new home for all things Critical Role. This includes past campaigns and one-shots, having access to the VOD of all shows immediately upon release, and new shows including The Re-Slayers Take podcast, Critical Role Abridged, and Critical Role Cool Down. Jaffe teased more to come and explained how Beacon is inspiring them to make more content. He also revealed how the Candela live show idea was sparked.
Taliesin Jaffe: "It's always great to show your work at the end of the test, and God, we have so many more things. We're really bad at slowing down. There's so many other things that are coming down the pipe that, honestly, we should probably take a minute to rest on a couple of those laurels at some point. But Beacon is a constantly evolving thing, and its encouraging us to make more content, which is good. So we're coming up with some new fun ideas of what to put up there.
The Candela live show was again one of those things where we said, Wouldn't that be cool? Just a couple too many times. And we're like, Oh no, we're doing it now. It's nice to see that we can actually pull off a little bit of interactive theater, even mild interactive theater, and that it worked. Maybe try something a little more daring and a little more daring as time goes on. It's amazing. I'm glad people enjoyed it so much."
Critical Role has largely shifted from a live-streamed show to pre-tapes, but they have played a few live sessions using their new system, Daggerheart. Jaffe explained how it is different to play live both in studio and on stage in front of an audience. He also discussed how the intense emotional response of the audience affected the players and shared his greatest fear about playing in front of a live audience
Taliesin Jaffe: "Well, we've played live a few times with Daggerheart now, which if you had asked me before that, I would say that there's no real energetic difference. There was a little bit more of a feeling of nerves, which is surprising because on a functional level it's not really that much different. The live audience on the other hand, I mean there's playing live on the internet, there's playing live in front of people and it is hard to describe. It is a very intense rollercoaster of having that instant response.
I suppose I'll say that the two things are, the intense emotional responses are always interesting is people actually laughing at your jokes or not laughing at your jokes, and it definitely encourages you to be a little snarkier than normal, just biochemically. And then the feeling, having an audience be emotionally invested or having fear or having a fear response even though it's quiet is intense and makes the stakes feel very, very heavy. God, my greatest fear is a TPK in front of a live audience. That would not go over well. That'd be so bad. That would feel bad for everyone involved."
Screen Rant: "It'd be very quiet drive home."
Taliesin Jaffe: "Oh, it would be a very, very rough that didn't sign up for Macbeth at that point. Just like, Oh, no. We came off the coast to A TPK not that long ago, so not to spoil, and we were genuinely starting to have that. I wonder what we'll do. Oh boy."
Jaffe couldn't share any surprises to come during the live show and explained how Critical Role is able to keep himself and the other players in the dark, so they can experience surprises with the audience. He revealed that on the rare occasion they do know a surprise is coming, it is usually related to scheduling.
Taliesin Jaffe: "I don't know anything. We do a pretty good job of keeping as out of that field as humanly possible. We do not discuss where we're going pretty much ever. There's some things occasionally that normally involve working around people's schedules, but I think that's happened maybe once this campaign. It just doesn't happen very often. It's a rare occurrence."
The costumes of the Critical Role cast during live shows have become a famed part of the experience, with each of them bringing their own style to a shared theme. This can be anything from pirates to cosplaying as their characters. Although Jaffe remained tight-lipped about what to expect from the Bells Hells live show, he did confirm that their theme had been chosen and stated, "Dress up is one of the best parts
Taliesin Jaffe: "Yes, we have. I suppose anything else would be spoiling. Oh boy. Yeah, I've been getting, poor Jenny has been texting me at one o'clock in the morning going, How about that? I'm like, Yeah, sure. Dress up is one of the best parts."
In the wake of FCG's sacrifice to save Bells Hells, the party has been reeling. Many of the Critical Role cast members have shared their feelings and the feelings of their characters, including Liam O'Brien in an earlier interview with Screen Rant. However, Jaffe hasn't fully gotten into the ramifications of Ashton's feelings about the loss of FCG. Ashton and FCG were close friends whose connection spans back to before the Bells Hells got together. Jaffe broke down how Ashton is handling the grief and processing this loss.
Taliesin Jaffe: "I won't talk to the other characters experiences. I don't really know necessarily where a lot have come from, but this is not Ashton's first rodeo with somebody close dying. It is, especially in certain subculture groups, it is not uncommon. It definitely is creating some conflicting feelings of who to blame, which is definitely getting in the way of Ashton's, maybe I need to be slightly less self-involved with my emotional issues. Like so many things in a game like this is being put on, I don't want to say a back burner.
Well, I guess we're caught up enough that we know that the notion of wearing something definitely came up and that kind of wake, I suppose, would be the best way to put it and that kind of level of honoring. Definitely, I suppose, I mean, anger is such an easy thing to say for a barbarian, but he's not really that angry of a barbarian as barbarians go. It's other issues, but that's such a good question, I'm trying to hit it just right. Definitely just a lot of trying to figure out where to put the blame, especially since this is exactly how Ashton knew it was going to go down.
If not there, when I suppose this was sort of a bit of an inevitability in their head. So sometimes it's blaming Change Bringer, sometimes it's blaming himself, sometimes it's blaming anybody for not listening to him. But right now, self-recrimination is always the easiest, its easy for most of us. That fight went very poorly for everyone involved. Definitely looking for other connection right now and realizing that they've been bad about that forever."
The Bells Hells quest has led them to Aeor, which played a major part in the Mighty Nein's story as well. Jaffe explained how Ashton's reaction to exploring Aeor is similar to Caduceus' during campaign 2. He also broke down how he views the stories of each party of heroes, from Vox Machina to Mighty Nein, and now Bells Hells.
Taliesin Jaffe: "Ashton and Caduceus are having the exact same response to [being in Aeor], which is it is absolutely batsh-t that someone like me is getting to do this. It is very overwhelming. This was not part of the universe's plan to actually go to the furthest reaches of the planet and see things that almost nobody had ever seen before. They're a little awestruck by the whole thing. They always are getting a little bit into their head and getting a little mildly self-important.
That's their main push right now is just, this is ridiculous. I don't want to say frustrated, but a little blown away that no one else is having that response of, We just went to the moon and now we're here! Does that not f-ck you up at all? It's just, How is everyone else okay, this? This is insane! They're definitely doing, How many people have actually been down here? And I think someone's like, Oh, there's been like dozens. I'm like, Dozens?! It's insane! God, think about that!
There is no reason why it should be us. This is in a very specific level, there's so many reasons it shouldn't be us other than, honestly, other than one member of our party. We are not that important. I often say it is a party mostly of sidekicks. Other than Laura, it is all characters who in any other circumstances would be mid-level NPCs. It is fascinating.
My go-to is Vox Machina where we're kind of f-ck ups trying to become heroes and Mighty Nein were villains trying to become heroes, or at least trying to not be villains, and then [Bells Hells] are somewhat ordinary people trying to just have some control, just trying to gain some control over reality. Which is very now. I'm not saying it's going well. I'm saying they're trying."
Although he wasn't at the heart of the recent interparty conflict of Swordgate, Ashton did have an intriguing reaction. While some of this was tied to their own recent bad choices, Jaffe revealed the different factors that gave Ashton more empathy towards Laudna. This included an understanding of where Laudna's dark path could take her with Delilah as well as guilt about how she got to this point.
Taliesin Jaffe: "Still coming down off of a lot of at least self-realization for whatever good it does. Half the battle, but the part that doesn't count. He's still coming down off of that self-realization. He's spent most of his life being, I don't know if you saw Cruella, but he's basically been the henchman of a evil genius. So he's not a good person. Well, he has spent most of his life being a somewhat broken, very corrupted person with a very, very well-developed moral compass, which is an odd thing to be.
Definitely after everything that happened with having an arm cook and then getting beaten pretty hard about it. They're feeling very defensive for anyone being, they're a little blown away that there's not a bit more empathy for everyone's situation right now, especially considering who we are. And feels a little responsible for where Laudna is right now because of what happened when the group was separated. Definitely is very protective of her as well, because she is the most paper thin, stiff breeze goes down, and is someone who is quietly also a bit of a villain or destined for it on an inevitable level.
He has a lot of poor opinions, or at least misguided opinions about the group. But I will say the one thing he knows, which I think is definitely true, is that everyone's dealing with their own sh-t. The whole point was they're supposed to be helping each other and understanding that everyone in this group, he spent his whole life around very broken people, and this is a group of very broken people. You have to hold everyone to a slightly lower standard and be a little nice about it. If that had gone any further, she would've been minced me. It would've gone badly for somebody. There's a protectiveness of everybody, but particularly the people who are on the edge."
Jaffe reflected on how a character he helped create is at the center of Laudna's struggle and his joy at seeing this character. He praised Marisha Ray not just for making this character but for the choices she has made while playing Laudna, especially with Sword-gate.
Taliesin Jaffe: "If you have a really loud bad voice in your head. That can be rough. Damage voice is bad, and boy, she's got the worst of it."
Screen Rant: "That you made."
Taliesin Jaffe: "Yeah, the Percy in my head is definitely like, Wow, I feel a bit guilty about this all. This is very much my fault. I love that Marisha made this character. It's such a fun character and so tragic. Yeah, I was very curious. I was very, I don't want to say I was surprised, but it was interesting to watch everybody's reaction to that. Marisha's like, I don't know how not to do this. We're just doing it. After the game, it was very, we were all like, What a throw. It was nuts."
Jaffe also discussed Asthon's origins and his connection to both Dunamancy and the Primordials. He explained how Ashton has felt after learning about these new aspects of himself and how it has impacted his understanding of himself. Jaffe also reflected on how Ashton hoped this discovery would forever change things and where they are with this new information.
Taliesin Jaffe: "It's interesting. I won't go into too many details, but all my characters tend to be paralleling, I try and find aspects of my reality, or my personality, or history that interconnect into them. The parallels between some of that and some other real-world stuff going on were very intense. I did my best to reflect my own experience going in and kind of having interesting revelations about one's past and just the assumption that it was going to change everything. It was something that they never really thought about or they thought they were never going to get, so it wasn't really on the menu.
And then, when it got put out there, it became an obsession. Then they were told they were very special, and immediately it went directly to their heads, and not in that braggart sort of way, but like, Oh, now I have all this. I have power, and I have responsibility, and I'm going to do all this. And then getting into the thick of it and realizing doesn't really change anything. It just doesn't.
They're looking forward to learning, less about their parents now that that's kind of beyond them, but the Primordials are interesting. It is a connection to the world that they never thought they were going to have. It's something that is talking to them where nothing else ever has. It does explain a lot of the things that have happened in their life, but not all of it either. They still have that weird thing in their head. Yeah, they're trying to pace themselves. They know some of their bad habits.
But it is an interesting mix of, I don't want to say disappointment because that's not what it is. There was a bit of disappointment that it didn't change who they were fundamentally. They were really kind of hoping it would. That's why they started dressing up like Superman briefly. Got the really nice, I'm going to be a superhero. I'm not a superhero. That was really, no, that was a bad call.
It has at least made them realize, they have to figure out on, at least on a practical level, where they come from, and what their responsibilities are, and what it means. Self-Discovery is not necessarily all about self-actualization, but it's also about just learning some cautionary tales, and trying not to make the same mistakes, and trying to also see what mistakes may be in the future or what you're capable of. That's kind of where it's at right now for as long as they can remember to be smart and not stupid."
