Firefox is the only way. : memes

[–] words_number@programming.dev 229 points 1 year ago (12 children)

Um actually... Opera and Edge weren't always based on chromium!

[–] LeTak@lemm.ee 104 points 1 year ago (8 children)

Chrome was not always based on chromeium. Chrome was based on Apple WebKit until 2013 when they forked WebKit and made the Blink engine.

[–] Dapado@lemmy.world 43 points 1 year ago

Chromium was still the base before the WebKit/Blink fork. Chrome and Chromium were released simultaneously in 2008.

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[–] narc0tic_bird@lemm.ee 27 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Pre-Chromium Edge wasn't even that bad. Sure, the engine had its issues and there was probably a bit of Edge-specific JS on some websites, but I'm sure they would've eventually got there.

But seeing that even Microsoft abandoned making their own browser engine, it goes to show how complex it is to make one nowadays and with new web APIs/features coming out every few weeks it feels like, it's almost impossible to keep up.

[–] TAG@lemmy.world 22 points 1 year ago (5 children)

But seeing that even Microsoft abandoned making their own browser engine, it goes to show how complex it is to make one nowadays and with new web APIs/features coming out every few weeks it feels like, it's almost impossible to keep up.

No, Microsoft is just historically bad at making browsers. It was not until Internet Explorer 7 that they finally implemented HTML 4 and CSS 2 without major glaring bugs.

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[–] TWeaK@lemm.ee 26 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Opera was the shit back in the early days. It could pretend to be any other browser.

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[–] MrSilkworm@lemmy.world 167 points 1 year ago (11 children)

Firefox with add-ons. Especially, but not only, Ublock Origin.

[–] eestileib@sh.itjust.works 28 points 1 year ago (3 children)

NoScript 🤌🏻

[–] persolb@lemmy.ml 45 points 1 year ago (9 children)

I love it in theory… but it just broke so many websites I needed to use. And not always in obvious ways.

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[–] beckerist@lemmy.world 136 points 1 year ago (8 children)

This is why I've stuck with firefox through thick and thin

[–] JokeDeity@lemm.ee 37 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Been using FF for about 2 decades now and I have never seen a single good reason to switch.

[–] EricKendrick@feddit.uk 21 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Ditto. As much as people pretend Firefox is niche, it is the only browser with lineage back to the start of the web.

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[–] amycatgirl@lemmy.blahaj.zone 111 points 1 year ago (22 children)

Brave, Vivaldi, Edge and other chromium browsers are forks of the main chromium project. They can decide whether to include or exclude features from mainstream chromium.

As far as I know, Brave and Vivaldi will keep Manifest V2 extension support and said that they will not ship WEI (Web Environment Integrity).

Discord uses a modified version of electron, and it's also probably an outdated fork as well, although I am not sure about that.

Steam, in the other hand, uses CEF, which they use as a way to render it's interface and as a replacement of VGUI (a good example of this is the steam game overlay), I don't know if they will ship WEI if it ever releases in chromium as there isn't a statement from Valve yet.

Sources:

ARSTechnica, Chrome's "Manifest V3" plan to limit ad-blocking extensions is delayed, https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/12/chrome-delays-plan-to-limit-ad-blockers-new-timeline-coming-in-march/
GHacks, Brave confirms it will support Manifest V2 extensions like uBlock Origin even after Chrome drops them, https://www.ghacks.net/2022/09/29/brave-browser-manifest-v2-extensions-after-v3-update/
Valve Developer Community Wiki, Chromium Embedded Framework, https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Chromium_Embedded_Framework
Github, Discord's Electron Fork, https://github.com/discord/electron

If I missed something, please tell me!

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[–] AncientBlueberry@lemmy.world 109 points 1 year ago (9 children)

Google accounts for some 80%+ of Mozilla’s revenue. Firefox struck a different kind of deal with the devil than chromium browsers, but Google is the one pulling the strings.

[–] CrabAndBroom@lemmy.ml 60 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Bit of a weird thought, but I wonder also if they see Mozilla as a sort of controlled opposition too? As in, keep Firefox around so they don't get in trouble over antitrust or something like that?

[–] merc@sh.itjust.works 67 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Mozilla.org is the corpse of Netscape that Google keeps animated so that it looks like they have competition when they really don't.

The existence of Firefox is something they can point to to say they're not a monopoly. The fact that 80% of the revenue Firefox receives is from Google means that Google effectively controls them. Mozilla has to weigh every decision against the risk that it will cause Google to withdraw their funding. That severely restricts the choices they're willing to consider.

Firefox is only 5% of browsers, so it really doesn't matter to Google if that 5% of users considers using a different search engine. Because of the Firefox user base, many of them will have already switched search engines, and because Google is such a dominant player, many others would switch back to Google if the browser used a different default. So, maybe 10% of that 5% would permanently switch search engines if Google stopped paying. Is that really worth billions per year? Probably not. But, pretending like you have competitors in the browser space and using that to push back on antitrust, that's definitely worth billions per year.

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[–] solivine@sopuli.xyz 21 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Could you expand on this

[–] gorysubparbagel@lemmy.world 73 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Google pays Mozilla in exchange for google being Firefox's default search engine

[–] can@sh.itjust.works 83 points 1 year ago (3 children)

I see that as an okay compromise. Anyone who cares will also know how to change it easily.

[–] SpaceCowboy@lemmy.ca 28 points 1 year ago (2 children)

And I actually wouldn't have a problem with using google for searches if it weren't for the fact they constantly do the captcha thing when I'm connecting via VPN. Captchas for a simple google search.

I'm not against google making money off of a good product, but they've enshittified it too much to be considered good now.

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[–] boeman@lemmy.world 89 points 1 year ago (2 children)

This feels weird to say.... I really think Microsoft should've stuck with trident / edgehtml.

[–] LeFantome@programming.dev 24 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Why? Because you liked the greater browser diversity or because you think it made a better browser?

[–] boeman@lemmy.world 28 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Diversity. MS had made great strides with EdgeHTML, but it was still pretty bad

But at least opening the browser didn't take all my ram.

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[–] Whirlybird@aussie.zone 25 points 1 year ago

It was actually one of the most W3C compliant browsers there is, more so than chromium based ones. Unfortunately google’s near monopoly has made websites focus on working in chrome, not on standards.

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[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 67 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Wait STEAM AND DISCORD ARE CHROMIUM?

[–] drathvedro@lemm.ee 70 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Yep, just like slack, spotify, and anything else looking fancy while wasting few gigs of ram to just open. They're built on electron, which is practically chrome without tabs.

[–] qwertychomp@lemmy.world 23 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I wish they could bring back mozilla prism. Like all this electron web app shit is popular, so we don't we use the faster and more efficient browser engine and use gecko!

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[–] boeman@lemmy.world 41 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Visual studio code is chromium.

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[–] Redex68@lemmy.world 31 points 1 year ago (13 children)

Yeah, just wrappers. Steam wasn't untill fairly recently, but they were slowly switching to it for some time.

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[–] mp3@lemmy.ca 55 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Mozilla doesn't make it as easy to use the Firefox / Gecko engine in other projects, which doesn't help for adoption.

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[–] A10@kerala.party 48 points 1 year ago (6 children)

Firefox is kept alive by Google default search money AFAIK otherwise why don't they sue google for showing different search results page in firefox

[–] phoneymouse@lemmy.world 50 points 1 year ago

It’s sad. Google basically owns the internet

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[–] complacent_jerboa@lemmy.world 47 points 1 year ago (6 children)

wait, the steam browser is chromium? no way

[–] fidodo@lemm.ee 49 points 1 year ago

Basically every in app browser is.

[–] letsgocrazy@lemm.ee 27 points 1 year ago (12 children)

How the fuck has everyone so easily allowed so few tech companies to dominate?

[–] OutlierBlue@lemmy.ca 23 points 1 year ago (3 children)

That's just late stage capitalism.

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[–] exu@feditown.com 22 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Chromium/Electron is just super easy to integrate. Afaik Mozilla wanted to make Firefox more easily embedable as well, but that project was killed.

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[–] gamey@feddit.rocks 44 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

I just wish Mozilla didn't just tread Gecko as part of Firefox, the few who tried developing on it came to the conclusion that it's not sustainable if the engines developer doesn't give a fuck about you! :/

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[–] Ascend910@lemmy.ml 37 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Laughts in LibreWolf

[–] jungekatz@lib.lgbt 26 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Techically an FF fork !

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[–] bennypr0fane@discuss.tchncs.de 32 points 1 year ago (2 children)

It gets worse. All Electron applications are Chromium, too.

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[–] Maguz@lemmy.world 29 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Firefox user since before it was called Firefox.

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[–] Whirlybird@aussie.zone 26 points 1 year ago (6 children)

Edge wasn’t always chromium. It was their own engine and it was great, but too many people complained essentially that it wasn’t chromium so they switched to chromium.

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[–] MixedRaceHumanAI@lemm.ee 26 points 1 year ago

But... but... it's an open-source...

[–] lewegee@lemmy.world 26 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Be sure to install AdNauseam on your Firefox to really go full "fuck you" to google.

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[–] Resol@lemmy.world 26 points 1 year ago (15 children)

Safari still uses the WebKit engine... right?

Google Chrome used to use WebKit before switching to their own weird engine that a whole bunch of other browsers now use.

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