The fact that pip is intentionally broken on macOS and some modern Linux distros sure doesn't help. Everything about environment management is insane.

[–] calcopiritus@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago

That is because when you're a beginner, you read everywhere that you should be using anaconda and jupyter notebooks. I know because I did so. Neither of them lasted more than a week on my computer though.

[–] tyler@programming.dev 18 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Comparing python env management to Ruby or rust or even Java for fucks sake just goes to show that nobody actually cares about how easy a language is to use, they just care about what is popular or what they think is popular.

[–] oldfart@lemm.ee 4 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Ruby, of all the examples you could come up with? My Redmine is updated only every few years because I rarely have a whole day to deal with the mess that is Ruby deps managent.

Java deals with this ellegantly.

[–] tyler@programming.dev 2 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

Huh? I assume you mean RubyMine and I have no clue what dependency issues you could be dealing with unless you’re on windows (which python is even worse with). You have one package manager and one build tool on Ruby, compared to Python’s now 16 tools. Ruby is the gold star for package management which is why both Rust and Elixir copied enormous parts of it when creating their tools cargo and mix.

[–] oldfart@lemm.ee 2 points 20 hours ago

https://www.redmine.org/ is a standard rails webapp. Nothing special. Straightforward to update, just a few commands, the only quirk is that at least one step always fails. Some obscure bug in a dependency, some problem with expected vs installed system libraries, or my favourite, a Segmentation Fault.

[–] oce@jlai.lu 3 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

Development environment is a mess, but given its popularity, it's not difficult to find an up to date tutorial. Then it is the easiest I think, you will be able to try programming basics and get a minimum viable product (small web app, small analytics...) easlier than with any other language.

[–] rikudou@lemmings.world 2 points 2 days ago

Nah, php over python any day. Equally easy to start, equally fucked up core, but the ecosystem around it is so much saner and easier. And I'd argue it's even easier for beginners.

Unless you need something that only has python bindings, I'd never choose python.