1230
5 years ago Valve released Proton forever changing Linux gaming
(www.gamingonlinux.com)
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 21 Aug 2023
1230 points (98.7% liked)
Linux Gaming
14815 readers
106 users here now
Gaming on the GNU/Linux operating system.
Recommended news sources:
Related chat:
Related Communities:
Please be nice to other members. Anyone not being nice will be banned. Keep it fun, respectful and just be awesome to each other.
founded 4 years ago
MODERATORS
I feel like attributing this to Valve is really disrespectful to the folks who developed wine for decades (and more recently also Vulkan). The real game changer is Vulkan, which made Linux graphics to be competitive with DirectX. (OpenGL interfaces to DirectX was simply not competitive)
You're right. So many people to thank here. One thing you cannot deny is that Valve is one of few companies that loves gaming on Linux and it deserves a huge credit.
Valve is a corporation, what they really "love" is money. All their Linux strategy is simply future-proofing. They know that if gaming kept being restricted to Windows, they could have been destroyed overnight by Microsoft, especially since MS start betting hard on gaming and built their own Steam competitor.
Well, they certainly do. I, for one, am grateful, since I've been using Linux for over 20 years. But I know they're in for the money, and that's ok.
Valve does not love gaming, they refuse to listen to TF2 fans, they never build games, they brought out studios, criminal cases, Antitrust lawsuit and branding loyal fanbase that keeps defending Valve awful actions in gaming. This is not love, this is toxic community and a toxic company aiming to be profitable at all cost.
Valve? Profitable at all costs? The same Valve that refuses to give sequels to games for their own IPs because they can't come up with ideas they feel are innovative enough, even though they know they would sell tens of millions of copies regardless of the quality?
The same Valve who literally gave Proton to the Linux gaming community?
That valve?
I don't know why this keeps having to be said, but companies need to defend their IP in court or they risk losing their trademarks. This does not mean companies are evil.
As for not listening to TF2 players, I'm pretty sure the game is still pretty popular so they must be doing something right.
I'm not a valve apologist. I hate that they've shifted their focus from developing games to developing their platform for many years. It's frustrating. But they did just release Alyx. And they are objectively doing some great things for the PC gaming community with the steam deck.
The Valve that pushed always online drm to the masses? That Valve that takes 30% of every purchase made on their monopolistic platform?
Yes, that Valve.
Let's not pretend Valve hasn't gotten to where it was against consumer interest and especially not that Valve is some kind of a good guy.
One more on top: That Valve that had to be forced to offer refunds and to this day offers the worst customer support in the industry by choice? (Yes that one)
Why would they need to make games when they can just sit on their ass and because of steam monopoly on games storefronts they would still be paid?
"As for not listening to TF2 players, I'm pretty sure the game is still pretty popular so they must be doing something right."
Like what? They arent doing anything but release workshop cosmetics lol. Did they even fixed the bot problem after all this time?
You're right, they don't need to make games. Yet they just released Alyx! Counterstrike 2 is known to be in development!
I don't play TF2, so I don't know what they're doing right, but people are still playing it so whatever they are doing is apparently just fine with a lot of players. Bots have been problematic in online games forever, I don't really know if that's a TF2 specific issue. In any case, they've already supported TF2 way longer than most companies actively support their non-subscription games so I'm not sure what level of expectation is fair really.
No one has to like Valve, but painting them as this evil force in the gaming industry is a little bit silly IMO.
Show us on the doll where Valve hurt you.
i guess was on the tf2 lmao, almost like it was a choice of the devs to not work on that spaghetti not valve, because that's how valve works, the devs do what they want
The kickoff meeting for Vulkan was hosted by Valve. Like everything it’s not only Valve, but they had their fingers in this too. Valve is just one of the companies/groups that is pushing linux ports and vulkan support.
Valve is mostly moving interests of big game companies with steam machines and steam deck. Steam machines flopped, but initially they made companies consider ports. The success of steam deck will likely result into them paying more attention to not break wine/proton.
Honestly, it feels like comments like this are just intentionally missing the big picture, or just don't understand any of what Valve actually do.
It's been said by comments elsewhere, but Wine was really not good years ago. It was difficult to use, obscure as you had to seek it out and know what to do. Valve funded DXVK, VKD3D-Proton, various extra Wine patches and pushed it all together into Proton with Q&A testing, regular upgrades for big games to get them working ASAP and put it in front of millions easily directly in the Steam client.
Which once again, Valve massively helped push and even hosted the early discussions on it.
It's a collaborative effort. The Wine and Vulkan projects have all done a lot and deserved credit for doing massive, amazing things. But for Linux gaming specifically, Proton has absolutely changed the landscape, and if Valve continues down this path, will make Linux an ever better gaming platform. So I don't think it's unfair to say thanks to Valve.
Not only have they sunk significant resource into making Linux gaming more viable, they've released Proton under BSD and seriously pushed developers to make Linux-compatible binaries. If Linux continues it's slow upward trend in popularity, Valve will be in large part to thank.
At least initially this was mostly DXVK though, which is a project that was secretly funded by Valve after it showed some promising initial results. Edit: but I agree that WINE deserves more credit.
as someone else said, it's a "standing on the shoulders of giants" moment for Valve
What exactly do you mean by "this"? The post is about the 5 year anniversary of Proton. Also, why do you consider crediting the developers of Wine disrespectful? I just can't follow.
Thank you. I found this post disrespectful, and insulting. Valve have started contributing to a long running project. Which is great, but there has been tremendous work over the years before valve, and even still
what is vulkan
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vulkan
still dont understand, eli5 please?
Games have to talk to your operating system to have it tell your GPU to draw lots of funny pictures that come together to make up the graphical portions of the game. Game developers do not want to do this directly, because talking directly to the OS is hard. As such, games talk to graphical APIs like Vulkan or DirectX to do the hard bit for them.
For years almost all games used DirectX, which is made by Microsoft. This gave Windows a virtual monopoly on PC gaming because they weren't about to let their competitors use their API. Then Vulkan came out, which was designed from the beginning to be OS-agnostic, sending us to the promised land of games that could (with some other efforts) run on any machine, anywhere.
When developers need to draw graphics on the screen, they use an API like Direct3D (or DirectX) or Vulkan to accomplish it. Direct3D only works on Windows. Vulkan works on many operating systems. Vulkan replaced OpenGL.
DXVK translates DirectX calls, which only work on Windows, to Vulkan calls, which will work on Linux and other operating systems. It's so good at this that it's better than commercial game engines like Unity. DXVK is a separate project from Wine. Wine also uses wined3d to convert older Direct 3D calls to OpenGL calls, for the same effect.
Lastly, there's VKD3D, which is Wine's own Direct3D12 ➜ Vulkan compatibility layer. Valve forked this and created VKD3D-Proton, which is specifically designed for games, as opposed to general software.
Yes, it's a bit confusing.