this post was submitted on 07 Dec 2024
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So, back when I was "still cis tho", there were a lot of aspects of male gender norms that bothered me deeply and of course I totally understand why now. Even though these days I obviously have a clear reason for feeling that way, I'm still curious if cishet men also have issues with how norms or expectations around gender and sexuality impact them in a negative way.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on how those norms impact you, whether good or bad.

Also, I should mention that since this is a bit of a sensitive subject we're talking about here, please be thoughtful and sensitive when discussing with others in this thread. Thanks! <3

EDIT: Much thanks for all the great responses here! I know it's a difficult topic of course, so I appreciate you sharing your thoughts/feelings like this.

Speaking of which... I just looked at /c/menby and some of the posts on the front page there are over 2 years old. I see a lot of the discussion here centered around not being able to share feelings and/or not having the spaces or support to do that in. /c/menby seems like the perfect place for that, just sayin'.

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[–] Bureaucrat@hexbear.net 8 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

::: spoiler CW: Mentions of abuse and violence

I cannot make mistakes, which means whatever I do I did on purpose however the recipient perceived it.
Not wanting to have sex with a woman makes me gay. If I am with a woman and I am unable to reach an orgasm, then that means there is either something wrong with her or me. Being good friends with another man means that I am gay. Being good friends with a woman means that I want to fuck her. If I don't show feeling then I am stunted. When I show feelings I am mocked. If I participate in a discussion with a woman then I am talking over her. If I don't participate, then I am timid and not a real man. If I am afraid or scared then that's a funny thing. I cannot be molested. I wasn't molested when someone got me super drunk, took off my clothes, drew on me, grabbed my junk, filmed it and shared it with others in our school. I cannot be molested. I have to "man up".

I have to be "a real man". Nevermind what that is and also that thing is toxic (it is, but the people who recognize this still tell me to be a real man in other words). I am constantly expected to be the adult, calm, rational, patient, protective, all-encompassing, all-capable paternal platonic protector. Whenever I step out of this role I am mocked. I am mocked for being lonely, I am mocked for being with friends.

On another level: While I acknowledge women have it hard, it can be very difficult to hear women talk about men in public. The "mocking" I talked of is not the mocking I will talk of now. I know the "imagine if you said x instead of y" is a bullshit thing, but I really do wish women would do this with how they talk of men at times, because sometimes it seems like they think they're incapable of reinforcing patriarchy. That goes for here as well. In leftist groups I'll see women, frankly, shit on men in very harmful ways and it's tough. I exist now in a weird superposition where I am both benefitting of patriarchy, with all the expectations that brings, while also no longer being in a patriarchal position (such as it was ages ago), but if I try to have that recognized then my beneficial position is brought up to dismiss my other positions.

I got beat by two of my ex-girlfriends "for fun". Never anything that left bruises, punches I could take. Not punches I wanted to take. Once I lightly shoulder-tapped my ex after she had hit me five times, I did this after telling her that I did not want to be hit, please stop, please realise this is unpleasant, please stop, if you do it again I will shoulder tap you. This was entirely unreasonable of me and I've been told so by more than just her. The verbal abuse I have taken is something else too, and it feels like it's just expected. Women need someone to unload on, sometimes their partners are just so annoying, it's almost a quirky little trait that they can be kinda toxic and unreasonable! Imagine if you had a friend and she told her her boyfriend "lightly hit her" from time to time when he was annoyed with her or just bored or whatever. "It's just for fun!" Imagine if she told you he would be entirely unreasonable from time to time and just expect her to understand that he was in a bad mood or whatever.
When we are told a man acts in this way, then we are rightly horrified. If a man complains about his girlfriend treating him like that however... More than likely he'll be called a boomer complaining about his "bit*h wife" or something like that. I know it sounds silly, but it really does get to me that women can complain about men in public (which they should) and get celebrated for it, but it doesn't really go the other way. And pointing this out I feel the need to underline that I know and understand women face immense hardships, systemic issues and all that, but it's just... It feel like it furthers the point I am trying to make. I dunno. Please just at least trust that I am coming with good intentions.

Fatherhood terrifies me. My cousin and his girlfriend left each other because she has an addiction issue. She tried to kidnap their child at one point. She has done drugs around the child. She almost won custody despite this (my cousin doesn't even drink and by all accounts he's a good guy. He does all he can for his daughter, he works extra hours so she can afford to ride horses and stuff.)
My uncle never lost custody of his kids, but his ex-wife moved to another country with their two children. Nothing the courts were willing to do, tough shit.