I know it's a shipost and this meme is at least 15 years old. But meat, cheese, and white bread (especially the ones in the US with added sugar) were never healthy

[–] TWeaK@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Especially the US white bread which contains a carcinogen.

[–] roadkill@kbin.social 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Take care not to make statements so inaccurate they are effectively meaningless.

"US white bread" isn't a singular brand and most brands don't "contain[s] a carcinogen"...
You never mentioned what the carcinogen was. Probably because it would compromise your argument that "US white bread" as a whole contains it when it does not. (It's Potassium Bromate/Bromide (it's used interchangeably online sometimes), for those wondering.)
It's not limited to white bread in where it can be used. It was an additive to flour in general.
A lot of the fear mongering blogs, written by 'influencers' whose research consists of 10 seconds of Googling but not verifying a single fucking thing they write about, name brands that contain potassium bromate... but actually don't. Example: Wonder bread (https://wonderbread.ca/our_products/white-bread-675g/) Chex Mix. Looking up their ingredients list shows the item in question is not used at all. https://www.chexmix.com/products/chex-mix-traditional/

TLDR: Think before you repeat vague, meaningless shit next time.

BTW, You should look into the horrors of Dihydrogen Monoxide.

[–] TWeaK@lemm.ee -1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

My statement is far from meaningless. Mild carcinogens are still carcinogenic. Sure, a small dose as a one of will not cause problems short term, but long term build up is a thing.

It's a preservative widely used in US white bread, but banned in Europe and other places.
I don't know the specific carcinogen off the top of my head, I've never bothered to remember it, and didn't look it up earlier while I was half snoozing being driven home.
So you do know what I'm talking about.
My source was Dr Joel Fuhrman. I'm not sure if you'd call him an influencer. While I do turn my nose up at some of his preaching, I think much of what he says is backed up by solid science. Not that I follow it myself. If it's since been removed from most products then good for you and other people in the US.

Your link to Wonderbread is from Canada.

Chex Mix doesn't contain azodicarbonamide (I'm guessing this is the one we're talking about? I wouldn't be surprised if there are others), but it does use butylated hydroxytoluene, which is also classed as GRAS (Generally Recognised As Safe) by the FDA based on a study from 1979. Yet both chemicals have since been called into question for their links to cancer. From a cursory glance, azodicarbonamide has a more proven link, while butylated hydroxytoluene has yet to be properly studied and the link is questionable.

Too much dihydrogen monoxide can kill you.

Alcohol is also carcinogenic - more so than bread additives - but I'm definitely having some of that tonight.

Also, Joel Fuhrman had a podcast talk about lemmy's favourite, BEANS.

Edit: Bloody kbin users, breaking lemmy threads. Supposedly there's a comment underneath mine, but it won't load, and there's nothing on kbin.

[–] downpunxx@kbin.social -2 points 1 year ago (3 children)

meat, cheese and bread were never healthy, says a man descended from 10 thousand years of meat cheese and bread eaters

[–] Karnickel@lemmynsfw.com 2 points 1 year ago

So if I come from a lineage of smokers it means smoking is healthy? I take your word for it, science man.

[–] fart@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

it's about the scale at which these items are consumed - eating meat every day was pretty much unheard of until the advent of capitalism

[–] substill@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Was it capitalism or was it refrigeration?

[–] KevonLooney@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Fresh or preserved (salted or dried) meat has existed as long as people have paid for them. Even ice was used for a while prior to refrigeration.

[–] kralamaros@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago

There are hundreds of ways to preserve meat without a fridge

[–] TheSaneWriter@lemmy.thesanewriter.com 0 points 1 year ago

Both. Refrigeration is what allows us to store and (I would argue more importantly) transport large amounts of meat, and is as such essential to the industry. However, Capitalism is also key to the meat industry because its lobbyists constantly push for meat subsidies, which is the main reason meat is cheap enough to be something we have every meal instead of once every couple of days.

[–] emidio@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Nobody ate meat before very recently. And cheese was not your typical daily treat. Remembers it takes a long time to produce

[–] BakedGoods@sh.itjust.works 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Humans have been eating meat for at least two and a half million years.

[–] TheFriendlyDickhead@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

But not in that quantity as we do today. In the past it was very special, because you allways had to kill one of your animals to eat some. And if you were a farmer who can decide to eat one big meal or ceep the animal and have milk for a long time its a preety easy decision.

And if you go back even more when humans were still "wild" meat was even harder to get. You had to hunt down an animal that was way stronger that you. So a hunt took days. If you got meat once every few weeks you were lucky.

[–] bric@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Sure, nobody ate anything in the quantities that we eat today, but that doesn't mean it wasn't a crucial part of our diet. It's amazing that modern industrialized humans are able to get enough calories and protein from a diet of varied plants, but if you're a hunter gatherer you don't have the luxury of a variety of genetically modified protein rich plants, you need meat if you're going to grow. That's the niche we evolved to fill, it's why we have a highly acidic gut, a medium length digestive tract common in omnivores, and teeth designed to tear meat. It doesn't take a lot of meat to meet a person's protein requirements, the occasional successful hunt is enough, but without any they would die.

[–] TheFriendlyDickhead@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I am vegetarian for over 5 years. You realy don't need any meat. That just some public believe the meat companies planted in our heads. For a vegetarian lifestyle your don't even have to pay attention to a lot of stuff. In general it's way more healthy if you do it right. The only thing is that it's usually harder to cook something tasty, because you can just throw meat in anything and it tastes like something.

[–] bric@lemm.ee -1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

But what you're missing is that being vegetarian wouldn't be possible without the conveniences of our modern world. You're relying on plants that have been heavily modified to be more nutritious to humans, and you're relying on a variety that would have been difficult to find pre industrialization, and absolutely impossible to a hunter-gatherer. It's not meat company propaganda to realize that human's evolved to eat meat, it's evident in everything about our physiology. From an evolutionary point of view, even farming is startlingly recent, an industrial world economy hasn't even registered yet, so even though we're living in a modern world, we're still dealing with bodies that were built to hunt. That's why so many types of overeating are such big issues, this farmed abundance just isn't something that we evolved to deal with.

None of that takes away from the fact that vegetarianism is feasible and healthy today, I think that it's great that we've reached a point where we can survive without meat. All that I'm saying is that we need to recognize it for the modern luxury that it is, instead of saying that it was ever the norm