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Oh yeah I 100% agree with that. Religion was basically a proto-government. It's funny, reminds me of when I was in high school. I was part of the student newspaper and at some point I had written an article about religion and how it is basically an antiquated form of government and how it has no real purpose anymore. Edgy I know. The next Monday in school I heard about how the town priest had read the article during Sunday mass. Apparently he was NOT happy about it. I was pretty proud of that one, not gonna lie 😂.
Yeah I think so too, but it can also easily go both ways, especially when you can't manage to get out of said shit. (Nvm I see now that I should read a bit further before starting to type bahah)
I do believe however that the ones who've inflicted the most pain on others as a result of their own pain have the potential to be the ones who try their hardest to make up for their mistakes, which is why I try hard to not discount anyone. I might be wearing rose-colored glasses but I have to keep them on.
Yeah the right associating with leaders such as Putin and Orbán is fucked up on so many levels. They definitely are good at what they do. That's one of the reasons I dislike how people on both sides treat each other like the other side is dumb. All sides have brilliant people and ignorant followers. And OF COURSE Hillary was corrupt, nobody who gets that far in politics has clean hands. They're all corrupted in some way or another but not necessarily equally. Centrist cunts fuck off.
One of my best friends, brilliant guy, doctor of philosophy. A couple of years ago he decided he wanted to get into politics so he started small. He decided to run for city council here and won. It didn't even take a year for him to absolutely hate the game. He said he could not sleep anymore, couldn't handle how corrupted even stupid little city council members could be. He said there was no way for him to stay there without getting his own hands dirty and he wanted no part of it. Within a year he quit, and left the town to go teach halfway across the world at the University of Liverpool where he still is now. He couldn't stand seeing these people anymore. It made sense then why our little town is dying. Even the tiniest amount of power is immense to tiny people. I'd like to see the day where we can offload a lot of these duties to some kind of AI, but that's a whole other can of worms that we are not ready to open.
Trump is someone I have a very hard time having any empathy for, but yeah, I also have a teeny tiny bit, because he really is nothing but a child. However I don't have any hope for him to ever turn around and do something good other than for his own selfish reasons. He is too old to grow up now.
Oh and on the subject of the Carlson-Putin interview. You wouldn't happen to have a link for a re-upload? I still haven't watched it because I refuse to even give it a single official view but I need to see it.
It is. We are all products of our environment. I don't think we actually have much control over anything, not even ourselves. That's definitely one of my wacky beliefs. I've never been able to shake off the idea that we live in a deterministic universe so it is hard for me to stay mad at a person or a group of people when I don't even believe they had any real control over their action. It would be like getting mad at the messenger. We still need to get mad and fight, but not the people. We need to fight ideas with better ideas. We need to love the people because they are us and we are them. Without them there is no us and vice versa. A world with no opposition is a world that would go sideways in no time.
In-fighting between humans has been a thing since forever and look where we are now. We are wayyyyy better off in most aspects than we were not that long ago. It's easy to forget that when we're forced to take a step backwards but we as a species will come back from this, we always have. At least, assuming we manage to heal our planet but unfortunately we can't do that if we don't somehow heal ourselves first.
Yeahhh.. I don't even know what to say about Jan 6th. That is such a messed up thing. I think that a lot of people who showed up at the Capitol didn't have bad intentions, they were misled. Although I'm sure there were plenty involved that absolutely had bad intentions. Most of them problably weren't there in person.
That's pretty much it. Most people don't want to fight but the news, the politicians, corporations, whatever, they've all figured out that pitting us against each other was very profitable. Not only do we have parasites at home, we have parasites on the outside as well trying to creep in and profit as well. At this point it feels like we can't trust anything or anyone, it's no surprise that there is a rise in conspiracy brains.
But you kinda are hahah, when have you ever seen something that is not dying in some way or another? All nations will eventually disappear or change into something completely unrecognizable. Either something new and better is born out of the seemingly rotting carcass that is the American empire, or something terrible to you will take it's place and that same cycle will repeat. It's terrifying to think that we could lose our way of life, I tend to talk like I'm not scared but really I'm terrified. It's the unknown part of it that is really scary.
Those who aspire for greatness often end up accomplishing nothing. You're doing the right thing. It's impossible for one person to change the big picture but you can absolutely change what is immediately around you and that is a very powerful thing. That is where we need to put our energy. I feel like the internet has done us a great disservice in that area. We are not ready to be so connected yet. We've lost the will to fight locally because we are way too overwhelmed with things that are happening where we are absolutely powerless to help. Take care of your close ones so that they can take of theirs. The rest will work itself out. This is no time for apathy.
(Are we going for the longest comment thread in Lemmy history or what?)
(There is a character limit for comments - or at least there was for Kbin.social and I assume for Lemmy as well? - so at the very least we are constrained in the length of each segment:-)
If you are interested, there is a book by the philosopher Daniel Dennett - who is a halfway decent author, e.g. of Darwin's Dangerous Idea, which is a DEEEEEEP look into evolution - called "Breaking the Spell", where he delves into the mechanics of studying religion with the same tools that you would study anything else. The latter is really boring so that book of his I normally do not so much recommend reading in-depth, but in your case perhaps you would, b/c in it he says things vaguely similar to what you are saying. Chiefly, that tribalism was adaptive to the evolution of mankind, and while nationalism helped lift us up beyond that, the next step was due to religion, which allowed us to cross national boundaries. Like, "HEY there fellow Pastafarian brutha/sistah - [Joey from Friend's voice] how you doin?"
So I would call it like a "meta-government", due to how it sits on top of existing governmental structures. Like in a lot of European countries - e.g. Spain - people that I have talked to that grew up there were angry b/c they paid one set of taxes to their government, and another set of taxes to the Catholic Church all the way in Rome, which like Americans they were subjected to "taxation without representation", and worse yet they simply had no choice in the matter at all - they did not "choose" that religion, but merely by being born there that choice was made for them.
Ngl, but the Catholic Church does do some good stuff - and whenever it e.g. feeds the hungry, visits the sick and constrained in prison, whenever it does as the Bible says and "takes care of widows and orphans", THAT is awesome and I support THOSE efforts 100%. Ofc when they lie and steal and cheat and murder and rape then THOSE efforts I am 100% against. I used to be very angry at the Catholic Church for a long time myself, though fortunately I healed, and now I see that the people inside of it do what they do not even just in spite of their religion, but sometimes because of it, though we are imperfect humans, and some are fairly deadly. It is just that with any political structure, or religious, or anything at all involving humans (and also chimpanzees, not only our closest living relative but also one of the only other species on earth that takes active delight in murder!), a close watch must be kept on it to ensure that it does not go astray.
And yeah, I keep hearing stories of people who step up to be that kind of old-school "statemen" rather than a "career politician", who cannot stand it and must leave. The literal DEATH THREATS offered to those people, by the most extremist among us, coupled ofc with the actual murders (like the Boeing whistleblower), have made me realize that the concept of "Illuminati" is absolutely real - maybe not as an actual irl society with a special ring and what-not, but obviously power corrupts, and obviously those who have it will concentrate the highest amount of resources to themselves - that's just ~~human~~ monkey nature.
I also quit something - a teaching position, not politics - and I have a great deal of sympathy with what he went through, it is not easy to just walk away, but ofc it would have been far worse if he had stayed and compromised himself. Everybody just said "try to do the best you can, and help those who you can"... implying to ignore everyone else, just take the money from the parents and run, never mind that one person physically cannot do the task justice, oh and then double the number of students on top of that, b/c why the fuck not, the computer will do all the "real work" anyway, right? :-| I would rather Epstein myself than heap such heavy burdens upon people though, saddling them with large debts while not helping them get ahead in life, and worse making them think they know something, by altering the externally-reviewed scores so that the school (I don't want to say which one) could avoid losing its accreditation, which it had already been warned about previously and was in danger of it happening again. You REALLY cannot help people, when the entire system is stacked against you to prevent that. Or perhaps I am naive and I should have stayed in, to be "one of the good ones", except I just am not that kind of person. It would have killed me, inside. So yeah, I GET IT. Somewhat, or at least think I do:-).
And yeah, maybe your town will die off then. Perhaps even... I doubt you will take this the wrong way so I will go ahead and say it: perhaps it should? Survival of the fittest and all, and that applies to towns just as well as species, and even the United States of America: if we do not "fit" into the existing world structure, then we might go down, at Putin's behest but also by our own stinking bloody hands, b/c we are too stupid to realize that the whispers he sent to us (e.g. "the vaccine is harmful") were not real nor even "our own".
AI will not be ready in time for us - maybe some future generation, but not us. Nor would we really want it to - shows such as Wall-E (and I have read similar stories for that identical concept written decades prior to that) have convinced me that when life gets comfortable enough, people will simply give up and allow "mommy"(/"daddy") to take care of them. Which is, to a large degree, the very thing that has put America into this mess we are in now? Laziness, more than any other singular factor.
Try to have empathy for Trump: fuck we all know that he does not deserve it, but it is not for him, it is for you. I don't care one bit about him, but I don't want you to have that monkey on your back, as the saying goes. He is a scared, whiney, piss baby who puts dumps into his diapers and then has trouble walking about. He acts that way out of fear, and b/c he knows no other way. In MANY ways, him being put in charge was not his fault, but rather those of people who are far more crafty (and have espionage capabilities) than he. He is a victim too - he is not just a symptom, mind you, being also a cause, but among the many things that he is, a victim is one of them. You or I possibly could have ended up there as well. Except, and this is the part I am learning more recently, we NEVER would - maybe if our entire backstory had been different, but as we are now and looking forward, we NEVER would have allowed that. There truly is a RIGHT and a WRONG, and Trump is all kinds of the latter. He is barely more than a monkey, while we have moved upwards by the power of Mind, and short of like dementia or some such, I cannot imagine anyone who has done that could ever turn back down. I used to shy away from that thought, b/c it seems not humble (in the midwestern USA that is YUGE to never appear anything other than humble:-P). But now I realize what true humility is: finding the Truth, whatever it is, and paying homage to that. Which makes him, and more importantly the system that put him there, my enemy. And even so, I still have empathy for the fucker... but I would still consign him to jail.
Likewise, I refused to watch the Tucker Carlson video too:-). But if you don't want to watch the whole thing - like me:-) - here is one with just the highlights and commentary from the GREATEST PERSON ALIVE ON THE PLANET EARTH RIGHT NOW, Jon Stewart: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oM2h3KnWAWY. It is The Daily Show, which I believe should not be HBO, so I hope you can see it.
Determinism: I also believe that. I cannot prove it though, so I don't hold to it too hard. Also, it doesn't really matter, to me, b/c even if things were fore-ordained, we don't know what those things are, so we must treat each new event as totally not that way, yes? :-P It's just an abstract idea in my head, consistent with there being 2 time dimensions (if I am remembering that correctly), or anyway if there is just the one, then it may be something along the lines of an exapanding wave of matter as it moves outwards from the Big Bang at constant velocity. If that were true, then time travel should be impossible, b/c once the wave passes, past times literally do not exist anymore, nor do future ones yet. An alternate formulation is that both past and present DO exist, and if we had the technology then we could travel along it, always "forward" but bucking the universal constant outwards pressure and instead returning to a "past" time/space continuum. Also, an outside observer could "see" our future. Then again, a "God" (like The Matrix computer), could foresee the future in other ways, not with foresight but simply with raw power, just like the Russian leader Gorbachev said "we will bury you"... and then decades later, it is happening - he meant it, he set things in motion to make it happen, nobody bothered to try to fight back, and, here we are). I think these thoughts are straight-forward from Einstein's theory that time & space are far more connected than people previously conceived. Ofc we do not "know", but is fun to conjecture nonetheless:-).
But then I read something from CS Lewis that entirely changed my thinking on that subject forever (one of his deep philosophy essays, I do not now recall which one). Yes, we may be pawns on a chessboard, but who is to say that WE are not ALSO the players!? If life is a video game, WE could be the characters, but "WE" could ALSO be coming down into our avatars from above. Truth tends to be stranger than fiction, and we truly don't know what's what, so any explanation could be the One. It could be just as likely that we are all "one", part of Gai and each having a dream of our own lives as if we are separated.
And moreover... damn I hit the character limit. Well, for now I will continue to a part 2, but I need to stop doing that at some point:-P.
Sheee's bAAAAaaaaack 😱
That does sound right up my alley I'll write it down. However my reading ability lately is not great. If I read 2 books in a year, that was a good year hahah. I already have a pile of books on my desk that has been there for about a year now and once in a while a book gets added on top but none get removed from the bottom 😭
I can relate to that a lot. I still feel guilty about how I used to be around religion. Particularly with my mom. She used to believe and for some reason I couldn't accept that. I would often talk shit about religion and her beliefs, try to convince her it was all just bullshit. Now I just ask myself why the fuck would I want to take that away from someone? Especially someone like my mom who basically just used religion as a way to calm her mind about the afterlife. Worst part, the most painful part, is that one of the reasons she probably believed so strongly was because it was a way for her to believe that she might be able to see my brother who died before I was born.
Ouch... I'm really sorry you've had to leave a teaching position. That is a tragedy, but don't bother second guessing your decision. Whatever you did was the right thing to do. You can still teach even though you aren't in a teaching position and I have a feeling you weren't in it for the fame and the fortune that comes with the official title of "Teacher".
Bahah none taken at all. It would be pretty hypocritical of me to take offense when I basically said the same thing about your country! It just is what it is sometimes. Maybe if we all understood that, we would take better care of what we have but no. Too many people take what we have for granted.
Agreed. There are no monkeys named Trump on my back at this point. In a way I don't really "care" anymore. I'd rather concentrate on the things that are happening rather than the people who we view as the cause of those things because it's never really just one person. Trump wouldn't have been able to do much if there wasn't a growing mass of people who somehow connected to the things he was saying. To put the blame on one person would be ignoring the true root of the issues. Do I believe he deserve every punishment he gets? Yes, 100%. What he does not deserve is my time and energy. I'd rather spend it on people who might end up voting for someone like him.
Hahah! Yaaaass! I wanted to watch the whole thing raw before I watched Jon Stewart on it though but I will probably end up just watching that instead.
Ahhhh yes. This is the part that really sent my brain into a death spiral 😂 It still does. It is just such a "fun" thing to think about. There is so much to think about when you know nothing. I see it as any other kind of belief. Since you can't prove it, it should only enter the equation when nothing else can help you make a decision. When there is no right or wrong, or all options are appear to be either right or wrong, to me that is when beliefs are useful. Then again, that is kind of why we're at this point in time right now. Ironic. Some beliefs are just more dangerous than others I guess, or maybe it's just the incompatibility between certain beliefs that is dangerous.
And yes, since we can't know whether we have free-will or not, we must treat it as if we did because our brain tells us we do but we still need to remember that our brain lies all the time. Well, maybe not as much lie as it omits a lot of information.
I like that thought. Inertia isn't only applicable to the physical world.
I have to apologize, I am having a hard time grasping your thoughts on space and time. If you want you can try to re-word that for me as I wouldn't mind having a clearer picture and toying with your ideas a bit.
Oh god yeah. That is something that I have thought about a lot. I also like the idea that we are all just one consciousness experiencing itself from within, or just a bunch of thoughts trying to sort themselves out in some sort of giant cosmic brain. I dunno hahah, these ideas can go pretty far and get pretty crazy. It's just so much fun to think about. I miss Timothy Leary, Terence McKenna and their crazy psychedelic-fueled ideas.
----PART 2----
Exactly.
Oh it is very rare that you will get to truly talk to someone. I think you're always interacting with a translation layer that sits between an interface and the actual mind.
I do believe there is a higher mind and that we all have it but that it can be buried and suffocated. It's very difficult to stay open-minded these days as we are constantly bombarded with crap coming from all directions. I can't blame anyone for closing that door after a while. I also think that you should never really be interacting with the same person twice. Healthy people grow and change constantly.
I know exactly what you mean. It is extremely difficult to hold on to. It takes a conscious effort to do so but it is absolutely worthwhile. To me it offloads a ton of weight from my shoulders.
This is part 2, space timey wimy goodness:
It is fundamentally difficult to grasp, yeah. CS Lewis has an illustration that I will ~~borrow~~ blatantly steal outright: imagine an outside entity who "sees" the entire trajectory of your life as a line, with all its twists and curves, and then, perhaps on a whim or to make it more beautiful art, decides to "outline" it, like maybe a highlighter or let us rather say one line "above"/to the left and another line "below"/to the right of it. From your perspective, your life appears "hemmed in", outlined, bordered by those two lines - as if you had no choices in the matter? Yet, that outside agent was the one who drew the lines, but following YOUR choices! That at least is the simplistic version, but it gets even weirder if, while the outside agent is drawing those outlining lines, your own lifeline changes in response. So if the agent starts drawing from the beginning of your life to the end, the final trajectory could change - according to YOUR choices, but in response to THEIR choices, which were themselves based on YOUR choices to begin with. Notice the caveat inherent in that: the "you" may change, from an alternate-reality you without interference from that outside agent, to now the "you" that has done so.
Even weirder, what if that "outside agent", who I mentioned earlier plays you like a chess piece pawn, isn't "God" or whatever, but YOU! In that case, "you" are the video game or storybook or whatever character, but in this formulation, the external agent is also YOU - moreover it would be the REAL you, whereas the one inside this reality is the lesser version. Ofc, here you must somehow have "forgotten" your true, higher self. And as you brought up, there may not be a 1:1 correlation between each of us down here vs. ourselves up there - all humans could come from just 1 or a few up there, or whatever. Anything is possible there, and we are only limited by our imaginations here. What we know for certain here is that what Religion tells us in this regard is fundamentally flawed and wrong - b/c it is inconsistent e.g. even the people saying so do not practice what they preach - but we do not necessarily know what the True reality is. Now we see only in part. I still like thinking along those lines b/c there are multiple ways to be wrong, and thereby thinking along several different lines could help lead us to Truth - e.g. we might not be "actually" one being (I sincerely doubt it, I see no evidence of it at least), but is there any doubt that we are all "connected" nonetheless?
This one hits me hard - my (autism-spectrumed?) brain constantly forgets this and wants to pick up right where it left off - more a reflection of my own reduced capacity to handle things than anything to do with reality. Speaking of, I had already forgotten that beautiful perspective that you had shared with me about nations changing. Stuff at my job, weird weather, for a few days my exercise schedule has been interrupted and I am just "off", and just like that it had already slipped through my fingers, again. Maybe, or at least I mean it did at the conscious level. That said, I tend not to try to hold onto anything too strongly, trusting that if it is good that it will find its way back to me in time. That... is nowhere close to true though:-(, and yet I know that I CANNOT hold onto things no matter how I try, so it is demotivating to even try.
And I think there is an evolutionary reason for this: community. No one person - a sage on a mountaintop lets say - can or even should really try to have it all, all the knowledge, all the wisdom, all the perfection. Rather, if we choose to surround ourselves with those who are worthwhile, and distance ourselves from idiots (it seems sad but what else can you do but that? they are hell-bent on their own destruction, and they will absolutely take you down with them!), then we can keep reminding ourselves of these beautiful Truths.
Or, so I say anyway, but then I don't actually DO it - oopsie, I guess I too am one of those who says one thing yet does the polar opposite, an "idiot" even. As too are we all, but one difference, not sure I can take "credit" for any of it but just saying it as a fact (or so it seems to me): some of us, for whatever reason, desire to know the Truth, and Reason, and Mind, while some of us, again for whatever reason, do not. THAT makes all the difference in the world, b/c I will eventually find what I seek, with effort + time, while they literally never will (and even if they stumbled upon it, they would set it back down again without realizing its significance). So I am grateful that I care, and therefore... almost grateful for the pain that I lived through that made me care. Most people would have no idea whatsoever what that means, but I don't even need to explain it further than that, b/c you already do.
I hope these thoughts are at least halfway entertaining:-D.
That is so relatable hahah. I think it's normal and that we all have those moments but I also do not know what normal is. I think that's where meditation and mindfulness can be really helpful. You sometimes must make a conscious effort to remind yourself of these things because the world we've built is just so overwhelming at times, it's easy to get caught up in it and forget. It's kind of like weightlifting for the mind/soul hahah. If you stop training you're gonna lose all them gainz!
Well of course. You are the sum of your experiences and if you are at a point where you are happy with who you are, then you must appreciate the pain you've had to endure to get there.
Absolutely! They have managed to take up an hour of what seemed to be the start of a pretty boring day.
Hehe, isn't it fun that we know nothing? Well, whether it is or not, that's just the way it is, so we adapt - it's what we are good at, and all that could ever possibly be done regardless:-P.
People that think (& act) as if their actions do not affect others do so as a result of that CHOICE to act exactly that way - just as those of us who do the opposite do as well. Facts may have little to nothing to do with that choice, except for some very few of us.
As you said also about the choice to be mindful - which is a separate aspect of the choice but that too is also a (meta-?) choice! I feel like I know, somewhat, how to excercise, but I really have no clue how people maintain their mental health. All the more so when it goes beyond "maintenance mode" into actively trying to heal from past wounds. Nor would I trust any resource that said that it knew, unfortunately. e.g., churches say that they know... and who knows, maybe they do? Like people, it would vary according to the individual one.
I do not know if I would say that I am "happy" with myself, but on the other hand I look at others who experience their own pains that are caused from the fruits of their own labors and... yeah, I see that. I often do not want to see that, but I do. I definitely see too much, yet also too little at the same time? As do we all.
Well, I am glad that my problems are amusing to you then - sheesh! (/s, I know you know but to be abundantly clear!:-P)