this post was submitted on 30 Jul 2023
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Piracy: ꜱᴀɪʟ ᴛʜᴇ ʜɪɢʜ ꜱᴇᴀꜱ

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Hi guys, first of all, I fully support Piracy. But Im writing a piece on my blog about what I might considere as "Ethical Piracy" and I would like to hear your concepts of it.

Basically my line is if I have the capacity of paying for something and is more convinient that pirating, ill pay. It happens to me a lot when I wanna watch a movie with my boyfriend. I like original audio, but he likes dub, so instead of scrapping through the web looking for a dub, I just select the language on the streaming platform. That is convinient to me.

In what situations do you think is not OK to pirate something? And where is 100 justified and everybody should sail the seas instead?

I would like to hear you.

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[–] GnuLinuxDude@lemmy.ml 8 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

IMO pirating media from anybody but indies is moral, correct, and good. The big companies have trade representation and lobbyists which they use to push their insane copyright agenda. Consider the Mickey Mouse act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonny_Bono_Copyright_Term_Extension_Act which extends copyright to such an absurd term, only corporate lawyers could have devised it. Which they did. Disney is a great example, in fact, since much of their media empire relies on adaptations of public domain works which are then copyrighted basically indefinitely. If our copyright laws today were more similar to what copyright laws were back then, we could have a lot more remixes, adaptations, and takes on well known stories and media.

Anyway, by purchasing from these copyright pushing companies I am funding their agenda, which is against sensible patent law and copyright law, and against me. They also promote vile DRM schemes, as their industry pushes ever onward away from personal ownership of anything and toward rent seeking behavior. If it were up to them we would all have tivoized boxes that we not only have to pay rents for, but must also consume ads on. Literally against my own interests to give them money, ever.

It's too bad that so much of our media is produced by a shrinking number of companies, because pirating their shit isn't even worthwhile. Most of their garbage is unwatchable slop.

As for any other form of piracy, I consider intellectual property to be mostly bullshit. But I can appreciate the time that goes into creating a work one wishes to sell and having some domain over that for a period of time after initial publication. But like many other things about our world, it's the stupidest version we have to live with.

P.S. and that's just one aspect of copyright law. Imagine trying to copyright the fundamental advances of human knowledge and science. God bless Sci-Hub!

[–] snowgrimm@lemmy.world 8 points 2 years ago

It is not okay to pirate just to resell to others. It is a huge red flag.

I pirate to save money and if industries are going to play hardball on making everything available.

[–] MrSilkworm@lemmy.world 8 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

I would call ethical piracy any kind of data acquiring that would otherwise be unattainable. A more common example is any kind of software and/or content that you pay and therefore should own and for any kind of reason the seller/provider restricts your acces to it.

  1. Whether it is a movie/series/book/song you payed and for some good forsaken reason you cannot access it because you changed your hardware or your country doesn't have access to it
  2. Or it is any kind of software that you have to pay a subscription to keep a feature you previously had on a previous version (ex. Adobe)
  3. or a video game that was removed from the service, has DRM and you can't access it anymore and/or the server shut down and the company doesn't release the source code
  4. or an even older game you own but the cartridge/cd/disk/cassette is destroyed and or the console is not supported anymore and/or it is abandonwarevand the current owner is not know so it cannot be commercially distributed

Coprorations do not want anyone to own the hardware they sell by denying the right to repair, let alone software. The mere sence is unethical, so it's ethical to at least acquire software through piracy.

[–] flynnguy@programming.dev 7 points 2 years ago (7 children)

I've been listening to A History of Rock Music in 500 Songs and let me tell you, the music industry can fuck right off. Small indie label? I'll probably buy it, but one of the major record labels? Set sail mateys.

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[–] FellowEarthling@lemmy.world 7 points 2 years ago

It's only ethical if you need the thing you're pirating, which doesn't apply to much. Pirate of you want, but look for ethics elsewhere.

[–] Morgikan@lemm.ee 7 points 2 years ago

I look at it this way: A company's goal is to generate revenue from some product's sale. So, I could ask myself two questions regarding digital items:

Am I making money from the piracy of that product? Is this product something I would have otherwise purchased?

As I'm not making money from it and they are not being deprived revenue as I would not have bought it anyway, my actions are therefore ethical.

[–] SinningStromgald@lemmy.world 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Everything on a streaming service that attempts to limit password sharing. They made traveling with a streaming stick a completely unnecessary faff. Everytime I go to use a service they make me reverify the device multiple times a day. So, fuck you asshole now I'll stream your content for other sites and stop paying you!

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[–] raptir@lemm.ee 7 points 2 years ago

I don't know about "ethical" but justified yeah.

Certainly if media is not available for purchase I have no problem with people pirating it. But also if it's not available in a reasonably accessible format. For example, I wanted to show my son the original TMNT show. I would have happily bought it on Vudu, Amazon or Play Movies, but it's only available on iTunes. I have all Android devices and don't even have a personal Windows device, so I would need to jump through serious hoops to get it working if I bought it.

[–] BillDoor@feddit.uk 7 points 2 years ago

I'm not sure I can think of any examples of unethical piracy, except maybe bootlegging for sale as mentioned elsewhere.

I don't believe that piracy hurts anyone, so I can't understand any arguments that it's unethical.

[–] godless@feddit.de 7 points 2 years ago

IMHO whenever you actively need something and the owner either doesn't make it available or the price is prohibitively expensive, it's justified. That especially includes papers, books and other tuition material that's been paywalled or made expensive as hell without any actual reason, even more so if the author gets next to no compensation.

Downloading series and movies that aren't being streamed anymore, by all means.

When it comes to current movies, it depends on what's available. Unfortunately most streaming platforms don't have Chinese subtitles, and my wife often struggles to fully follow the original audio and the English subs often disappear too quickly.

For software, my personal stance is that if you use something every once in a while, pirate away. If you use it regularly and/or generate income from it, then pay your dues.

[–] Fleppensteijn@feddit.nl 7 points 2 years ago (12 children)

Suppose some dude on the street hands out books for free and gives you a copy. Does it make you unethical for accepting one? Would it be different online?

Suppose your government charges a "blank media tax" on storage devices to "compensate" creators with the assumption you already "illegally" download their content, didn't you already pay for it anyway?

What if you're downloading stuff as a hobby but you'd never pay for it if that would be the only other option, did anyone lose anything of value?

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[–] ram@lemmy.ca 7 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Any instance in which I'm purchasing through a publisher or producer. Wherein I have no reasonable belief that my money is actually going to the people who developed the work.

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[–] bouh@lemmy.world 7 points 2 years ago

I expect to pay a fair price for things. Unfair pricing are profits made from monopolies which are illegal. Copyrights exist to enforce monopolies, and thus are unethical in my view. It is especially evil when lobbying pushes laws that develop mass surveillance, private militia and automatic justice. While these laws exist, piracy is an act of resistance against oppression.

And it must be mentioned : science should be free. Especially medical science.

What pisses me off with copyrights is that the unethical or outright evil behaviour come from the copyright owners, but they turned the laws so the evil behaviour is legal and we now have these questions about the ethic of so called piracy.

[–] shufflerofrocks@lemmy.world 6 points 2 years ago

Perfectly ethical:

  • Content that is Inaccessible legally such as old games, abandonware, delisted media, banned stuff etc.

  • Digital copies of physical content you own

  • Digital Content that you already own such as ebooks or movies, but are restricted access due to DRM or single-copy rules or other dumb stuff. If I paid for something I should have the right to access it however I want (as long as I don't distribute it)

Gray Area:

  • Pirating work that benefits a publisher but not the creator. Movies, Shows, and Songs released by studios that exploited the creators of that material and not giving them a cent. This includes scientific work and research.
[–] Anticorp@lemmy.ml 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Paying for the product after viewing/using it if you like it or it's good.

[–] hoodatninja@kbin.social 6 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

My favorite refrain as a kid was "we'll buy a copy at the show" lol. In our defense we often did!

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[–] coffinwood@feddit.de 6 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

I wanted to watch the Clarkson-Hammond-May "Top Gear". Only on BBC iPlayer. Only in the UK.

The roundabout 22 series' and specials simply do not exist outside of that. What are you supposed to do? I would have paid the BBC, but they even discourage the use of VPN's themselves.

[–] om1k@sopuli.xyz 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

When I don't want to give money to a specific company that I dislike. EA is an example.

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[–] stewie3128@lemm.ee 6 points 2 years ago

If you couldn't afford to pay for it in the first place, then they're not losing any money.

[–] ox0r@jlai.lu 6 points 2 years ago

Considering I'm pretty pisspoor at the moment everything is. And tbh if I had money I still wouldn't pay for movies but I would buy a lot on bandcamp(so I can make torrents out of it)

[–] tiny_parking@lemmy.world 6 points 2 years ago

Software wise, anything without a demo. The support from companies is dire at the best of times and if something doesn’t work on your system your screwed. In shops you can test the suitability of something by testing it (sitting on a couch, laying on a bed) but with software they take your money and run.

Also anything abandoned is fair game.

[–] burgersc12@sh.itjust.works 6 points 2 years ago

When you have zero money

[–] Dark_Blade@lemmy.world 5 points 2 years ago

If the copyright holder no longer provides a legal way to acquire any piece of media directly from them, making it so that the only way to acquire it legally is in a manner that prevents the copyright holder from seeing any profit, and the legal option is essentially a grift where you’re sometimes paying 100x the sticker value for something where the copyright holder won’t see a single cent…

[–] Teknikal@lemm.ee 5 points 2 years ago

The one time I felt truly justified is when I bought quite a few vita games digitally and Sony took me not signing in for a few months as an excuse to wipe my account. They did email but I didn't see it until the account was gone.

So yeah hacked my Vita and downloaded everything I had owned and more.

[–] CaptObvious@literature.cafe 5 points 2 years ago

If I’ve paid for it once, but the Powers That Be make it unavailable or want to charge again to continue using it, I have no problem with finding a copy that works to make my purchase whole.

[–] littlecolt@lemm.ee 5 points 2 years ago
[–] 3valc@mujico.org 5 points 2 years ago

Pirating anything from nintendo since they won’t release anything from the gamecube era and the new games never drop in price.

[–] teft@lemmy.world 5 points 2 years ago (1 children)

All piracy is ethical since all information should be free.

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[–] cmat273@sh.itjust.works 5 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Anything from Nintendo is fair game IMO.

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[–] xyzinferno@lemmy.world 5 points 2 years ago

For me, I mostly rationalize my piracy as something generally unethical that I choose to partake in anyways. People often cite piracy as an issue with the service being provided, but there's just a lot of instances where I'd rather pirate something than pay for it, not because the service is bad, but because "Why pay for something when I can just get it free, eh?"

Though I think there is one specific case where I'd undoubtedly consider piracy ethical, which is for products that are not being sold on the market currently. Take a retro video game for instance. If it isn't being sold by any company, then there is no way to legally play the game apart from getting a secondhand copy. Either way, the company that owns the rights to it won't derive profit, and they aren't involved in secondhand markets whatsoever, so pirating the game effectively results in 0 negative consequences for any party, compared to legally acquiring it.

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