this post was submitted on 16 Jul 2025
268 points (97.5% liked)

Games

40679 readers
1959 users here now

Welcome to the largest gaming community on Lemmy! Discussion for all kinds of games. Video games, tabletop games, card games etc.

Rules

1. Submissions have to be related to games

Video games, tabletop, or otherwise. Posts not related to games will be deleted.

This community is focused on games, of all kinds. Any news item or discussion should be related to gaming in some way.

2. No bigotry or harassment, be civil

No bigotry, hardline stance. Try not to get too heated when entering into a discussion or debate.

We are here to talk and discuss about one of our passions, not fight or be exposed to hate. Posts or responses that are hateful will be deleted to keep the atmosphere good. If repeatedly violated, not only will the comment be deleted but a ban will be handed out as well. We judge each case individually.

3. No excessive self-promotion

Try to keep it to 10% self-promotion / 90% other stuff in your post history.

This is to prevent people from posting for the sole purpose of promoting their own website or social media account.

4. Stay on-topic; no memes, funny videos, giveaways, reposts, or low-effort posts

This community is mostly for discussion and news. Remember to search for the thing you're submitting before posting to see if it's already been posted.

We want to keep the quality of posts high. Therefore, memes, funny videos, low-effort posts and reposts are not allowed. We prohibit giveaways because we cannot be sure that the person holding the giveaway will actually do what they promise.

5. Mark Spoilers and NSFW

Make sure to mark your stuff or it may be removed.

No one wants to be spoiled. Therefore, always mark spoilers. Similarly mark NSFW, in case anyone is browsing in a public space or at work.

6. No linking to piracy

Don't share it here, there are other places to find it. Discussion of piracy is fine.

We don't want us moderators or the admins of lemmy.world to get in trouble for linking to piracy. Therefore, any link to piracy will be removed. Discussion of it is of course allowed.

Authorized Regular Threads

Related communities

PM a mod to add your own

Video games

Generic

Help and suggestions

By platform

By type

By games

Language specific

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] markovs_gun@lemmy.world 4 points 4 hours ago

I think the biggest problem is that steam is like 80+% shovelware and it's no surprise that a lot of those are using a bunch of AI generated "artwork." IMO it's no worse than a shitty asset flip and as others have pointed out, there are a lot of really cool things you could do with generative AI in game dev that aren't just slapping shitty pictures all over your product, and this doesn't capture the nuance. I would also assume that this number is lower than reality since it relies on tagging, and nobody is accurately tagging shitty scam games with less than a hundred downloads.

[–] qevlarr@lemmy.world 12 points 7 hours ago

Steam should combat shovelware whether it's AI slop or human slop

[–] echodot@feddit.uk 17 points 11 hours ago (2 children)

The way that valves AI tag works is kind of a problem.

There is no subtlety to it at all, if you use AI in any capacity during the development of the game you need to declare it via that tag yet all the tag then does is say "AI in this game", but there's a big difference between having the AI develop the entire story or produce all of the artwork, and having AI write boilerplate camera controls for a farming simulator.

[–] exu@feditown.com 8 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

I agree that having more degrees of usage would be useful, but erring on the side of caution and declaring any AI use as a first step is better than doing nothing.

[–] echodot@feddit.uk -3 points 6 hours ago (2 children)

Okay so there is this whole arguement going on about The Altars how apparently a tiny piece of background art has AI generated text in it. Personally I feel that's absolutely fine, as otherwise it would have just been Lorem Ipsum, and really doesn't need to be declared but technically, under the strictest interpretation of that tag, it should be declared even though you can't even see it unless you zoom in.

I would very much like valved actually come up with a concrete policy rather than a vague one-line statement.

[–] Croquette@sh.itjust.works 4 points 4 hours ago

With how many games are released on Steam, how can AI be quantified and enforced?

E.g. Does using Intellisense need to be declared?

[–] childOfMagenta@jlai.lu 4 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

Does using copilot to code count as "made with AI" too?

[–] qevlarr@lemmy.world 4 points 7 hours ago (2 children)

Of course, that's why we need better guidelines. It's like beauty ads that have to declare they used Photoshop. Every photo is edited if you don't make it clear what you mean

[–] RandomVideos@programming.dev 7 points 6 hours ago (3 children)

Why should something not be disclosed just because its common?

[–] qevlarr@lemmy.world 0 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

I didn't say that. It should be more specific to have any meaning to the consumer.

[–] RandomVideos@programming.dev 3 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

But it has meaning to some consumers. Not everyone can tell that an image has been majorly edited or created using a program created to replicate pictures

[–] qevlarr@lemmy.world -2 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

You mean the idea that if wasn't created completely by people? It matters to you that some unpaid intern wasn't forced to work overtime writing the most boring bullshit scaffolding code?

[–] RandomVideos@programming.dev 2 points 2 hours ago

That kind of behavior should be disclosed too

[–] vithigar@lemmy.ca -3 points 6 hours ago* (last edited 6 hours ago) (1 children)

Because it becomes meaningless noise instead of useful information.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alarm_fatigue

[–] RandomVideos@programming.dev 4 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

Even if it is ignored by a lot of people, its better than not knowing at all

[–] vithigar@lemmy.ca 1 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

I'm not saying there shouldn't be a disclosure, but an uncertain threshold that might be as low as "a developer accepted a copilot completion suggestion one time" isn't useful. You just end up with a prop65 situation where it's slapped on everything and basically meaningless.

[–] RandomVideos@programming.dev 2 points 2 hours ago

Steam allows you to describe the use of AI

Also, if you know you are making a game for steam, why not just ignore the copilot suggestion? I dont think it will increase the time to make a game by that much time

[–] echodot@feddit.uk -3 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

Because I don't think anybody actually cares that much if you use small pieces of AI code. What people don't want is everything being AI produced.

Right now though the AI tag is been applied to both scenarios with no distinction.

[–] RandomVideos@programming.dev 2 points 1 hour ago

But there is a difference

Steam allows you to describe how you used AI

[–] childOfMagenta@jlai.lu 2 points 7 hours ago

Yeah, I suspect the AI tag should apply to even more games then.

[–] markovs_gun@lemmy.world 0 points 4 hours ago

I think the biggest problem is that steam is like 80+% shovelware and it's no surprise that a lot of those are using a bunch of AI generated "artwork." IMO it's no worse than a shitty asset flip and as others have pointed out, there are a lot of really cool things you could do with generative AI in game dev that aren't just slapping shitty pictures all over your product, and this doesn't capture the nuance. I would also assume that this number is lower than reality since it relies on tagging, and nobody is accurately tagging shitty scam games with less than a hundred downloads.

[–] dubyakay@lemmy.ca 6 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

I have an acquaintance who is a lead Dev at an Indie studio where he is developing and training an NPC behaviour engine with thousands of responses and actions. Think fallout or mass effect response wheel, where 2-4 dialogue choices have 2-4 outcomes, but instead you can tell the NPC anything and it will have a different response. Or it will do different things whether you hand it a book, give it book, throw a potion at it or cast a healing spell on it or hug it. It could also change tactics if you tried to snipe it vs if you went at it melee. All of these are trained and accounted for and made in a way where it can be built into any game using a certain engine. And this is just aimed at generic npcs, not companions.

So if this is what disclosure of the use of generative AI means, I'm not against it. I think there is nuance to what can be done with it. Using final art assets? It's theft. Writing? Theft. NPC behaviour? Definitely not.

[–] shoo@lemmy.world 3 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

Strange to not qualify the last one as theft. If it's out putting code, it's from the same kind of training set. If it's out putting character responses, they're from that same literary training data.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] gerowen@lemmy.world 23 points 19 hours ago (2 children)

Honestly, maybe I'm an old fart, but I refuse to knowingly buy games if they use AI instead of paying talented people to create works of art.

[–] Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In@lemmy.world 0 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

What if talented artists use AI to enhance their original work?

[–] lastweakness@lemmy.world 3 points 4 hours ago

An interesting use case for me in programming has been prototyping. Stuff I otherwise wouldn't have the time to experiment with suddenly becomes something feasible. And then, based on what I learnt while having the AI build the prototype, I can build the actual thing I want to build. So far, it has worked out pretty nicely for me.

[–] echodot@feddit.uk 4 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

Well that's the problem isn't it it depends entirely on what the AI is being used for. The truth is we don't know because Steam doesn't tell us.

[–] ArchmageAzor@lemmy.world -2 points 7 hours ago

There's a simple solution to the case of AI use in game development. It should be in the background, not the foreground, and it should replace grunt work, not professional work.

[–] logicbomb@lemmy.world 39 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I read a story recently about how a graphic designer realized they couldn't compete anymore unless they used generative AI, because everybody else was. What they described wasn't generating an image and then using that directly. They said that they used it during the time when they're mocking up their idea.

They used to go out and take photographs to use as a basis for their sketches, especially for backgrounds. So it would be a real thing that they either found or set up, then take pictures. Then, the pictures would be used as a template for the art.

But with generative AI, all of that preliminary work can be done in seconds by feeding it a prompt.

When you think about it in these terms, it's unlikely that many non-indie games going forward will be made without the use of any generative AI.

Similarly, it's likely that it will be used extensively for quality checking text.

When you add in the crazy pressure that game developers are under, it's likely that they'll use generative AI much more extensively, even if their company forbids it. But the companies just want to make money. They'll use it as much as they think they can get away with, because it's cheaper.

[–] jj4211@lemmy.world 8 points 14 hours ago

What I dread is a game lengthening dialog using AI. Some folks mistake quantity for quality, and make their games unbeatingly tedious. Just like games that lean heavily on procedurally generated content.

[–] ozymandias117@lemmy.world 58 points 1 day ago (2 children)

How many of the ~6,818 titles now disclosing generative AI use were already on Steam in 2024?

I.E. are a lot of these just games that had already been released, updating their disclosure statements based on Valve's new rules?

The article says 1/5 games released this year use it. I'm not sure if ~34,000 games have released on Steam in the last year

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] count_dongulus@lemmy.world 2 points 14 hours ago

Using generative AI to replace toil and not the creative human process is fine imo. Even doing something like generating visual things, to me, is OK if it's driven by real creative intent and doesn't result in something that looks low quality. But it's not very simple to get output that you can tweak in fine ways to get predictable changes based on specific creative intent - human language is not descriptive enough to really capture that. "A picture is worth a thousand words" is accurate. You're also shooting yourself in the foot when you end up with a ton of assets or systems that you don't have fine control over because you can't do something simple like tweak a layer of an image because what you got at the end of the day was just a raster output from a black box.

load more comments
view more: next ›