this post was submitted on 25 Jan 2024
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Unpopular Opinion

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There's this rising narrative going around that if you ask specifically for a CIS partner, you're a transphobe. That could be true for some people but it's not fundamentally related to bigotry. Moreover, this narrative, the "if you only want a CIS mate then that is prejudice" is trampling on one of the most important rights a person can have: the right to choose who they want to get intimate with.

First of all, transmen are in fact men and transwomen are in fact women. Let's get that out of the way. This isn't a foot in the door for "trans this really isn't that" narratives. What this is about it is the freedom to choose who you want to be intimate with. That right is sancrosanct, it is absolutely inviolable.

And yes, there's plenty of issues that make transgender dating a special issue. If someone reveals their TG status they can be open to hate crimes and even deadly violence. However all marginalized groups are special in their own way. As a black man I don't think it's racist if a woman says she doesn't want to date a black man. I face oppression, too. My class is special in its own way. One group isn't more special than the other. None of us have the right to force ourselves upon those who don't want to be intimate with us, even by omitting who we really are.

Really, if you have to deceive or hide who you are in order to date someone, do you really want to date them? I wouldn't. That's not fair to you and you're denying them their right to choose who they want. What do you think will happen when the person wants a CIS mate and they discover the truth? They're going to get pissed and dump you. Now you have to shame them into staying with you: "If you loved me for real this wouldn't bother you"... that's not going to convince anyone. They're either going to leave, or they'll resent you forever. That's just how it is. You can be mad at that but that's about as effective as protesting the rising of the sun. There's just no way to win once you've gone down that road.

"I want a CIS mate" is not the same as "trans women are not women" - one is a preference, the other is harmful prejudice. On the flip side CIS people who do date trans people shouldn't be shamed for their choices either. A man should be free to date a trans woman and not catch flak about it. Trans people should be able to be openly trans and not face hate speech or threats to their well-being. This, without any exception whatsoever.

The fundamental fact is when you shame or worse abrogate people's right to choose who they want to get intimate with, it's not going to end well for you. All you're going to get is people who resent being coerced or bullied to date people they don't want to. And that's not something the country, or the world, will ever put up with. Except that right now, most people don't imagine they can be labeled a transphobe just for wanting a CIS mate. And unpopular opinion: that should be nipped in the bud.

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[–] expr@programming.dev 12 points 9 months ago (4 children)

There's a difference between having a preference/orientation and outright saying "no trans people" on your profile, imo. The former is totally fine and I think the vast majority of people think the same. If you did the latter, I would definitely remove that. It's unnecessary and can make people feel shitty. Just swipe left on people you aren't attracted to, and if you find a dealbreaker while talking to someone, politely disengage.

In general, I find it's best to avoid putting any kind of negative thing in your bio. Both because you run the risk of making people feel bad for no reason, and because psychologically, you want people to associate you with positive things about you, not the things you dislike. Most people have a lot of dealbreakers that are far too numerous and exhausting to enumerate anyway. Just asses for yourself, and if you don't like something about someone, move on.

[–] hamsammy@lemmy.world 8 points 9 months ago

I agree, and I believe OP does too, but I read their post as "since we live in a world where trans people can't 100% feel safe or want to post the fact that they are trans, and we end up dating and I later find out they are trans and I did not want this in a partner, now we've wasted everyone's time when it could have been addressed from the get-go." I believe OP is trying to discuss what the best way of putting this preference on your profile without straight up saying "no trans people".

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[–] littlecolt@lemm.ee 11 points 9 months ago

I have never run into this, honestly. I would assume if you are looking for a possible sexual relationship, that a person's sexual preference matters. Not to say gender is not important, but sex also is in this instance. If you expect a dick and get a clit, that's going to be a bit of a let-down, no matter how much you are romantically attracted to the person. I think it's mature to have this conversation early in the relationship. More people need to understand that you can discuss this kind of stuff like adults and well, if you're someone looking for a certain type of partner, there should not be shame attached to it.

[–] carnimoss@lemmings.world 10 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (9 children)

I don't trust the way this question is framed. Yes people have preferences but why do you have to ask other people how to talk to someone like a human being? We are human. You can just have a conversation with us.

I've had girls attracted to me even when knowing my trans status which other people started screaming about saying I must be a girl (I even have facial hair). So the idea that cis hets can't EVER be attracted to us is a lie.

Basically I don't trust anyone else's opinion on this. We are people. This is not Build-A-Date. Learn to communicate like an adult. Not every trans person has the same set of equipment.

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[–] paddirn@lemmy.world 10 points 9 months ago (1 children)

The one thing that kind of disturbs me about trans relationships when I've called it out, is that trans men and trans women don't feel the need to disclose that they're trans to their partner, as if it's not something important that the other person has a right to know.

Just to be clear, I have nothing against the trans community and I think it's horrible that they're being made into scapegoats and getting attacked by right-wing assholes, but at the same time, people have a right to know some things about their partners. I think trans folks have every right to transition into whatever makes them happy. If people are open for that relationship, more power to them, I am happy for you, BUT that's still a choice that somebody should be allowed to make on their own whether they want to be in that relationship or not with full knowledge of what's going on. To me, it's borderline sexual assault if you've not disclosed that to a partner, since knowing the truth could potentially have changed their actions, though maybe it's more something like "sexual fraud".

The arguments I've gotten against this from some people just don't hold up, things like, "Well you wouldn't disclose every dental procedure you've had to a partner would you?" No, because nobody gives a shit about how many crowns you have when they're trying to have sex with you, that's irrelevant to the situation. Whereas, "this person biologically started as the opposite sex and they've made a transition", is kind of a big deal for some people and could be a deal breaker. Whether you think that judgement is bigoted doesn't matter, that's a boundary that they've set for themselves and should still be respected. Them declining is probably helping you dodge a bullet, since them finding out after the fact is WAAAY more likely to go south pretty quick.

[–] Mahonia@lemmy.world 12 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I don't disagree with any of the content of what you said, but I've never met a trans person who defaulted to nondisclosure. And doing that is a very unsafe move for any trans person.

There is the typical "I'm gonna at least see if there's some genuine interest here before I decide if it's worth it to have this conversation," but I've never met anyone who would forgo that up to and after sex. I don't think this is common at all.

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[–] giddy@aussie.zone 8 points 9 months ago

I am the dad of a transgender person and I agree. Sexual and romantic attraction should never be held to the same standard. The heart (and the genitals) wants what it wants

[–] creditCrazy@lemmy.world 8 points 9 months ago (3 children)

Personally I agree. Personally one of the biggest factors that makes me want to get into a relationship in the first place is more or less to make a kid. Sure adoptions are a thing but like I just don't see myself getting turned on by sex with someone who doesn't have a vagina. The most I can see her doing for me is a hand job. Shallow yea but that's just kinda biology. I can't see anyone making me enjoy a trans woman anymore than you can make a gay dude enjoy a cis woman. And all that's not even mentioning I live in a place where parents still pressure their children to make grandkids.

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[–] HelixDab2@lemm.ee 8 points 9 months ago

...I'm pretty sure that no one except extreme I-don't-know-what people are saying you can't have anatomical preferences.

No one is going to say that I'm homophobic because I'm a cisgender heterosexual man that is only interested in dating cisgender heterosexual women. If I was going to be accused of homophobia, it would be for doing things that dehumanize gay people, like denying them basic rights afforded to straight people. (And, for the record, there are a lot of cis-het women that I would never date, even aside from the fact that I'm married.)

On the other hand, what is transphobic is the idea that transwomen are trying to "deceive" you. Maybe you could just, I dunno, try using your words? Talk about shit? Like, I don't date people that are religious, "spiritual", or takes astrology/tarot/etc. seriously; I am not going to have enough respect for someone that believes that nonsense to be in a relationship with them. If someone isn't in-your-face about it, I'm not going to accuse them of trying to deceive and trap me when I find out; I'm just going to leave.

[–] answersplease77@lemmy.world 8 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I define a partner and see relationships differently. A partner is not someone you just fuck. I'm not even gay but I'd rather be with a guy who wants me than a soulless shallow golddigger girl who pretends and manipulates me thinking she likes me. I'm too old for this crap. my heart matters a lot more than my balls

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