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Bill Barr says Trump often suggested executing rivals in heated White House outbursts
(www.independent.co.uk)
this post was submitted on 30 Apr 2024
812 points (98.0% liked)
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You’re hardly the first person to think that the end result is always the same
Except the end result has historically always been the same; Hate begets hate.
What do they say about the 'definition of insanity' again? “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.”
Insanity is doing nothing while you watch sociopaths ruin the world for all living creatures for the foreseeable future.
The fact that you can only see violence as the option to "doing nothing" is sort of the problem.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonviolent_resistance
There's power in unity. Much moreso than in violence.
nonviolent resistance worked in the 20th century because there were still plenty of people who cared or at least pretended to care. the 21st century is basically sociopaths, dissociative personality types, and pacifists. there's no good people left with a spine and you're about to see what that world breeds. it may already be too late.
Unions still work just as well as they did last century. Hell, they work better.
What you're essentially saying is that "well this thing that has never worked is the solution and we shouldn't use the thing that has been proved to work".
It is hard to organise activism globally, but nonviolence still works better than violence.
What stands in it's way is people believing there's no point to nonviolent resistance... a bit like you.
violence was never a viable option because organizing it has been impossible for the common man. we now have the tools to coordinate globally and discreetly.
Yeah the 'lack of organisation' isn't the problem.
Unions work, authoritarianism doesn't. Your lack of belief in nonviolent activism is partially responsible for the state of the world, so stop it with the inane violence fantasies and start doing something.
What non-violent resistance movements of Jews were there in Europe? Because I don't know of any. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_resistance_in_German-occupied_Europe
The battle for humanity's future is fought with words, not bullets. Lovely irony in you trying to call someone else naive, as all you're capable of is cheap "we should beat up the baddies" BS, which achieves less than nothing, being in itself harmful to the discourse.
I'm actually in the military reserves. I'm trained and ready to defend my country, with weapons, if necessary. Can you say the same? It would be somewhat naive to call someone a "limp-wristed do-nothing" if you're not in the military and you think vague threats of violence to some poorly defined "them" is more effective at achieving things than discussing them like adults.
"What non-violent resistance movements of Jews were there in Europe?"
There was no resistance. everybody saw it coming and did nothing until it was too late.
"The battle for humanity’s future is fought with words, not bullets."
The history books tell a very different story. Again, naive.
"Lovely irony in you trying to call someone else naive, as all you’re capable of is cheap “we should beat up the baddies” BS, which achieves less than nothing, being in itself harmful to the discourse."
I promise you if the baddies fear for their life, they're going to be very hesitant to roll over the people. If the last time X baddie attempted some sociopathic cruelty, they ended up picking up their teeth afterwards, they will think twice about doing it again.
"I’m actually in the military reserves. I’m trained and ready to defend my country, with weapons, if necessary. Can you say the same?"
I'm armed and trained as well buddy.
"It would be somewhat naive to call someone a “limp-wristed do-nothing”
If it walks like a duck...
"some poorly defined “them”
I have a list.
Again, you're ignoring the last 4000 years of civilization if you think violence is an ineffective tool for change.
Your refusal to read history doesn't make your fantasies true.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_resistance_in_German-occupied_Europe
"I promise you if the baddies"
And you don't see any irony in writing out things like that in the same comment that you deign to call someone 'naive' in?
So that's a "no, I'm not in the military, but I'm an American gun-owner". Yes, I think that's probably readily apparent to most people reading this conversation.
You still can't even define "the baddies" (what a hilariously inane concept to begin with), let alone propose anything else than vague threats of violence aimed at "them". Unions and politicians actually achieve things, while you sit there, terminally online, shining your Walmart bought guns and fantasizing of violence.
It really isn't the fault of others that you refuse to read history. "Facts don't care about your feelings" as I've heard some other equally rhetorically talented American say.
Authoritarianism doesn't work. Unions do, like other forms of cooperative movements which utilise the extremely broad economic and political power that the masses have, when organised.
Never heard of Tank Man either, I suppose?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonviolent_resistance
There's a whole list of hundreds of examples from before the beginning of our calendar to modern day. I stress, once again; you refusing to read history doesn't make your fantasies true. Those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
Jim Grech Shaikh Nawaf S. Al-Sabah Michael Whatley Larry Fink Clarence Thomas Samuel Alito Neil Gorsuch Jonathan Lockwood Tucker Carlson Ryan Lance Amin H. Nasser Greg Abbott
I could go on...
But whatever. You refuse to acknowledge that the death of any of those guys would be a win for humanity? I guarantee you we would see more results with swift action in that direction than useless protests and -checks notes- singing.
"I could go on."
Oh, please, do.
So you are asserting that we should just straight up execute those people, and some other possible petroleum company leaders and shitty corrupt politicians, and that will definitely fix the world. And you don't see that being reductive or naive in the slightest?
You refuse to acknowledge that non-violent activism can deal with systemic change better than your ridiculously vague threats of violence towards a couple of examples of politicans and fossil fuel people who could be replaced instantly with another one just like them.
You still refuse to read history. Just just refuse. Just like you claim you're "trained", which you are not, you do not know history, in the slightest.
How did the civil rights movement work in the US? Why?
Who has arguably been more influenftial in the history of the human race, Jesus or Hitler? Do you know what the word "martyr" means and where it comes from? Can you name the last time workers rights were improved by explicitly violent movements (and not peaceful protests which turned rowdy).
No-one is denying the power of change of violence, but I'll forgive you thinking that, because reading comprehension doesn't seem to be one of your strengths. The point is that non-violent cooperative movements are much more powerful for meaningful, lasting change.
Since you just absolutely refuse to acknowledge the power of nonviolent resistance in favour of your childish fantasies, allow me to list examples.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Trinidad_and_Tobago#End_of_slavery
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women%27s_suffrage_in_the_United_States
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passive_Resistance_(Hungary)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_1st_Movement
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1919_Egyptian_revolution
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-cooperation_movement_(1919%E2%80%931922)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_resistance_movement
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_resistance_to_apartheid
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii_Democratic_Revolution_of_1954
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_rights_movement
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opposition_to_United_States_involvement_in_the_Vietnam_War
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prague_Spring
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Revolution
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larzac
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People_Power_Revolution
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singing_Revolution
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_of_Liberia_Mass_Action_for_Peace
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otpor
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rose_Revolution
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Egyptian_revolution
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_revolution
The fact that you can't see that your resistance to the idea that nonviolent resistance is more powerful for meaningful change (not to mention morally superior) is partly responsible for why the world is as shit as it is. And if yo somehow found a genie to make your fantasies true, the world would be an even worse place. Who do you think you are? The Unabomber? Just drop off a few "evil" keyfigures and the world will all right itself. It's not about achieving systemic changes in attitude, let's just summarily execute some corrupt idiots, because there's definitely not more to replace the ones you decide aren't worth living.
It's just so utterly utterly childish what you're writing mister not-a-trained-soldier. I have taken a literal vow to defend my country, and will do so, but unlike some deeply disturbed gun-bros, I don't dream about violence, I actively avoid it. See, unlike you, I'm not afraid. That's why I don't own a gun, I'm not a pussy who "needs one for protection". I confront people, but I don't need to resort to violence. I use my words, like an adult person. And I do that with for example the fairs I drove when I used to drive a taxi, oftentimes meaning drunk and drugged up bikers as well. None of them ever hit me, although everyone that got mad said they would. Hot air, just like you. Nothing more.
If you actually want to improve the world, at least keep your mouth shut so you're not bothering actual conversations with your useless violence fantasies.
as i said in my previous reply, i'd like to really explore our differences in depth. i would like to mention now that, if you rinse repeat the process i described, no one would ever want that job and without leadership, these companies would begin to crumble and exert less influence over global politics.
And neither of us will be the first person proven wrong on our respective points.