this post was submitted on 14 Jul 2024

400 points (94.1% liked)

collapse of the old society

1002 readers

4 users here now

to discuss news and stuff of the old world dying

founded 2 years ago

MODERATORS

ex_06@slrpnk.net

Midnight@slrpnk.net

400

[CrimethInc] Trump campaign aims to use today's shooting as a sort of Reichstag fire to incite his supporters to step up street violence (slrpnk.net)

submitted 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) by cerement@slrpnk.net to c/collapse@slrpnk.net

58 comments fedilink hide all child comments

https://todon.eu/@CrimethInc/112782702007709408

The Trump campaign aims to use today's shooting as a sort of Reichstag fire to incite his supporters to step up street violence while calling for more state repression targeting his enemies of choice.

The Biden campaign has already paused all outbound communications and withdrawn their television advertisements, ceding the entire field of narrative to Donald Trump, who will have no compunction about using his status as a victim to advance his efforts to victimize others.

One of the classic mechanics of totalitarianism is that protecting the safety of the leader becomes a justification for violence against large swathes of the population.

As centrists join the far right in paving the way for totalitarian rule under Trump, we have to organize to defend our communities. If you have been in denial about the challenges ahead of us, this should be a wake-up call to find each other and prepare for them.

top 50 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old

[–] grue@lemmy.world 108 points 5 months ago (3 children)

~~Beer Hall Putsch~~ Jan 6? ✔
~~Enabling Act of 1933~~ Trump immunity SCOTUS ruling? ✔
~~Reichstag Fire~~ Failed assassination attempt? ✔

Night of the Long Knives coming up next, and soon.

[–] snekerpimp@lemmy.world 31 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I am soooooo glad someone else is seeing the similarities. “Those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it.” Well someone studied it and said “well damn, I can do it better”

[–] Anticorp@lemmy.world 10 points 5 months ago

Those who do study history are doomed to watch as those who don't study it, repeat it.

[–] prole@sh.itjust.works 17 points 5 months ago

Don't know if I should feel vindicated after years of warning people about this and being mocked and derided and banned, or if I'm just sad that we're allowing this to happen.

It's some bizarre mixture of the two, but sadness definitely makes up the bulk.

[–] ZombiFrancis@sh.itjust.works 5 points 5 months ago

We speedrunning now.

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 60 points 5 months ago (3 children)

The Biden campaign has already paused all outbound communications and withdrawn their television advertisements, ceding the entire field of narrative to Donald Trump, who will have no compunction about using his status as a victim to advance his efforts to victimize others.

This is why we can't have nice things. Fucking feckless Democrat leadership being timid in the face of a fascist takeover 🤦

[–] perestroika@slrpnk.net 27 points 5 months ago (3 children)

Knowing psychology, almost any PR advisor will advise to temporarily cease media attacks against a person who's been shot.

As a minimum, messages may need to be reworded, because Trump is likely to change his messaging after his narrow escape.

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 10 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I see what you mean, but to go completely incommunicado is just shooting themselves in the foot and tacitly admitting that "Trump is even worse" is their ONLY strategy to avert what's by now looking like almost inevitable defeat.

[–] perestroika@slrpnk.net 9 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

The interesting part: Democrat officials made public statements about going silent for a while, and those statements reached headlines even in Europe. You can go silent and still have your statements in headlines.

Also, as far as money and efficiency are involved - if they save money now, they can advertise more later. Currently, advertising against Trump would have a low efficiency, since he currently receives positive attention. I think their current action plan is "let's wait for Trump to open his mouth".

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 9 points 5 months ago

You can go silent and still have your statements in headlines.

Yeah, but those statements were statements of sympathy and the Dems patting themselves on the back for taking the high road. At best, they won't do anything, but more likely those statements all help Trump.

if they save money now, they can advertise more later

Sounds good in isolation, but the campaign was at the very beginning of an emergency push to claw itself out of a hole with a major PR offensive. They can absolutely NOT afford to take their foot off the gas right now.

Later, they'll just be bailing water from a ship that's already on the bottom of the ocean.

Currently, advertising against Trump would have a low efficiency

Continuing to try to convince people that Biden is capable of doing the job would be just as effective and just as crucial for the survival of the campaign's chances for success as it was yesterday.

I think their current action plan is "let's wait for Trump to open his mouth"

Which is a ridiculously unwise plan. The right wing echo chamber music other for profit yellow press will treat any direct reaction to one of Trump's ridiculous lies and fascist policy statements as a mean bully attacking a poor shooting victim who never harmed anyone.

They were slowly beginning to either fool the country into believing that Biden is capable or picking a replacement but now neither is likely to happen and this will be the last free presidential election.

[–] prole@sh.itjust.works 4 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

OK, but this isn't PR for a big budget film, this may decide whether we have a future as a republic or not.

Definitely re-worded, but to just stop altogether is foolish and so short-sighted.

[–] Muffi@programming.dev 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Why wouldn't it be smart to go full-on anti gun ownership as a PR response from the Democrats now?

[–] GroundedGator@lemmy.world 2 points 5 months ago

Because you are a reasonable person.

Everytime there is a violent act involving guns and the left says that we need to do something, the right will make excuses. This will not sway a single one of them to think the guns might be the problem.

Gun sales will increase now because liberals are coming to take them.

[–] rayyy@lemmy.world 23 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Republicans have no principles. Democrats have no spine - Professor Alan Lichtman.

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 10 points 5 months ago

Yeah, pretty much spot on.

[–] rayyy@lemmy.world 7 points 5 months ago

ceding the entire field of narrative to Donald Trump

Does anyone else see a great money grift coming on? MAGAs will be sending their entire paycheck.

[–] octopus_ink@lemmy.ml 58 points 5 months ago (2 children)

This was my literal second thought after I heard what happened.

[–] detectivemittens@beehaw.org 22 points 5 months ago (2 children)

I was worried about this since people were whipping a frenzy about how this had to be antifa.

The shooter is a white male gun enthusiast Republican. How awkward for MAGA.

[–] octopus_ink@lemmy.ml 15 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

I was worried about this since people were whipping a frenzy about how this had to be antifa.

The complete and utter failure to understand what antifa is and is not has been one of the most entertaining aspects of the maga cult.

Remember that very neatly painted "anarchy" symbol that "antifa" painted on that guys garage? lol

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/minnesota-trump-supporter-pleads-guilty-fire-blamed-left-wing-vandals-rcna51799

Could a Democrat or a "leftist" have been responsible for the attempt on Trump? Sure, but it seemed unlikely to me, and not because I have some belief that the left doesn't have guns or nutjobs. Just didn't feel like that kind of thing.

But "antifa" coming to assassinate anyone? No. Sorry magas, antifa seems as hard for you to understand as is basic empathy for people unlike yourselves.

[–] maynarkh@feddit.nl 5 points 5 months ago

When has the truth ever posed an obstacle for them? Or anyone else for that matter?

[–] The_Che_Banana@beehaw.org 8 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Here come the ~~brownshirts~~ Khaki chinos boys

[–] EmptySlime@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

You can type 2 ~ on both sides for strike through text. So ~~brownshirts~~ becomes ~~brownshirts~~

[–] The_Che_Banana@beehaw.org 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

sub sub makes the font smaller, its "~~" on either side that made it work, but thank you for giving me the tip so i can fart around with formatting now!

[–] EmptySlime@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Ah, I couldn't tell on my phone what specifically you were going for lol. It looked like you were trying to do the strike through text joke and the formatting didn't work. Either way I'm glad it helped. I love using formatting tricks to play around with words in comment sections like this. Have a good one!

[–] The_Che_Banana@beehaw.org 1 points 5 months ago

You too!

[–] MrMakabar@slrpnk.net 38 points 5 months ago

This is so bloody unreal. The main suspect was even a registered Republican. All of this according to the FBI.

There was some evidence that the Reichstag was torched by the Nazis as well. I can really do without the irony.

[–] perestroika@slrpnk.net 25 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Some notes:

almost no doubt: this will have a mobilizing effect for Trump supporters ("our great leader is being attacked", etc)
possibly: this will improve Trump's ratings among voters with no clear political preference (a big story where he's not the villain is what he needs)
pattern: historically, surviving an assassination attempt has improved a candidate's chances of getting elected; in the most recent example, Slovakia's prime minister Fico enjoyed a boost in ratings while in hospital after being seriously wounded

I don't blame Democrats for temporarily ceasing campaign advertisement. Two principles dictate this: "you don't kick a person who is already down" (Trump was incredibly lucky and isn't) and "you don't attack someone who has martyrdom effect". Generally, you wait until the dust settles. Democrats too will wait until the dust settles. They will also check the popularity ratings and decide how to proceed.

In my opinion, Democrats would strongly benefit from a younger candidate. I would advise getting someone under 55 to run. Among the wider population, not enough people understand that, as things are, the Democratic candidate is Kamala Harris, her name is just currently Joe Biden. :o

Overall, it seems that Trump has considerable chances of getting elected president. Preventing that will require exceptional effort and considerable luck. Only if the Democrats manage to paint a clear picture of what a Trump presidential term would bring about, and only if that picture causes their voters to show up and vote nearly without exception - only then will things turn out differently.

My personal view from Eastern Europe - contingency plans for a Trump presidency ceasing aid to Ukraine have a very high probability of occurrence now (estimated time: early 2025). Over here, everyone and their cat will researching cheap weapons systems to replace things that only the US can provide. I think that group will now include myself.

[–] Anticorp@lemmy.world 18 points 5 months ago

Well, duh! That shooting gave him everything he could have ever dreamed of, including an absolutely perfect photo op.

[–] veganpizza69@lemmy.world 18 points 5 months ago

The Biden campaign has already paused all outbound communications and withdrawn their television advertisements, ceding the entire field of narrative to Donald Trump, who will have no compunction about using his status as a victim to advance his efforts to victimize others.

Classic liberals.

[–] sp3tr4l@lemmy.zip 17 points 5 months ago

And to think I had people downvoting and screaming at me in other threads when I pointed out that this would happen.

[–] Sanctus@lemmy.world 10 points 5 months ago (1 children)

This really sucks. If you aren't armed already. The violence ahead will be bad.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] PriorityMotif@lemmy.world 9 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

In an abundance of caution the Biden administration should keep Trump somewhere safe until the election is over.

[–] Omgpwnies@lemmy.world 3 points 5 months ago

There's a spot just a short boat ride southeast of Mar-a-lago...

[–] Bieren@lemy.lol 8 points 5 months ago

Without a doubt they will. And when he wins the election, he will ban guns and take them away. Can’t have a chance of something like this happening again.

[–] prole@sh.itjust.works 8 points 5 months ago

The Party of "law and order," folks.

[–] Passerby6497@lemmy.world 7 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Oh good, because the reichstag fire was also perpetuated by the party in question.

[–] Etterra@lemmy.world 5 points 5 months ago

Yeah called this last night too. I guess America was nice well it lasted. I mean I'm still going to fucking vote, but I don't have high expectations.

[–] Thteven@lemmy.world 3 points 5 months ago

Lame and totally expected.

[–] SeattleRain@lemmy.world 2 points 5 months ago (2 children)

I ain't scared of some rascal riding MAGA supporter.

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 9 points 5 months ago (5 children)

Ever heard about firearms? Turns out you don't have to be in shape to fire them and one shot can be enough to kill. Maybe want to read up on that.

load more comments (5 replies)

[–] shalafi@lemmy.world 3 points 5 months ago (3 children)

Keep beating the drum that they're all fat losers. You have no idea how wrong you are.

load more comments (3 replies)

[–] ulterno@lemmy.kde.social 2 points 5 months ago

This picture reminds me of the "Sniper Elite" game I played as a kid.

load more comments