this post was submitted on 13 Nov 2024
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Greentext

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This is a place to share greentexts and witness the confounding life of Anon. If you're new to the Greentext community, think of it as a sort of zoo with Anon as the main attraction.

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If you find yourself getting angry (or god forbid, agreeing) with something Anon has said, you might be doing it wrong.

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Java

Thats your first mistake bucko

[–] svcg@lemmy.blahaj.zone 160 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I also think Java is shit, but if you manage to get a NullPointerException while writing a hello world program, maybe anon is just not cut out for computers?

[–] navi@lemmy.tespia.org 85 points 1 week ago (2 children)

I always loved that Java has a NullPointerException but doesn't have the concept of pointers in the language (only references).

[–] dukatos@lemm.ee 44 points 1 week ago (2 children)

That is because they planed to add pointers and then gave up.

[–] RogueBanana@lemmy.zip 30 points 1 week ago

I can't tell if you are making a joke but I can believe it could happen if it's Java

[–] morrowind@lemmy.ml 17 points 1 week ago

I mean... they have them. And unsafe. You're just not supposed to use them

[–] starman@programming.dev 18 points 1 week ago

C# has NullReferenceException and it actually makes sense.

[–] Ilovethebomb@lemm.ee 75 points 1 week ago (18 children)

Can anyone who's actually dealt with Java tell me how much Anon is exaggerating?

[–] scottmeme@sh.itjust.works 136 points 1 week ago (5 children)

I've worked on a corporate project with multiple Java services, anon isn't really exaggerating. Java can be a hell scape at times

[–] taladar@sh.itjust.works 48 points 1 week ago (1 children)

They forgot to mention that production Java applications apparently need to log a certain minimum number of completely meaningless stacktraces per hour to work properly. Or at least I assume that is the case from the fact that all of them do that.

[–] HackerJoe@sh.itjust.works 28 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Best with an old and vulnerable log4j on a Windows log server.

We don't know what'll happen if we update. And we don't know if the dude who coded it will answer our calls. YOLO!

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[–] kitnaht@lemmy.world 81 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (3 children)

I'm pretty sure Java doesn't have pointers, so writing a hello world application isn't gonna fuck up nearly that hard.

The one thing he forgot though is that your source file is probably in the folder

com/companyname/net/classes/factory/factoryfactory/worker/lib/bin/refresh/jdk/model/ui/closebutton/press.java

And spread out among a bunch of other directories, and the java file is like...3 lines. But there are 10k files spread all around directories like this that are all 3 lines a piece with a class definition.

[–] SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world 35 points 1 week ago

Everything in Java is a hidden pointer

[–] perviouslyiner@lemmy.world 18 points 1 week ago (1 children)

wait, so when .io gets deregistered, are a load of companies going to have to rename their root directories and rewrite all of their include statements?

[–] kitnaht@lemmy.world 41 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

Thankfully, despite naming them like that, it doesn't actually seem to have any real purpose. Apparently they just wanted to make sure that different companies making different libraries didn't accidentally use the same name for their project....

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[–] bluelion@sh.itjust.works 45 points 1 week ago (3 children)
  • a hello world doesn't need libraries in Java
  • installing JDK takes at most 5 steps, depending on the OS
  • a nullpointerexception is more likely the developper's fault (unassigned value, calling a function on a null object)
  • IntelliJ is easy to install and modern (granted, other IDEs are very ancient)
  • developping GUI apps is a PITA, no matter the ecosystem (generally)

The rest is more or less spot on (no idea about concurrency issues though)

[–] Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world 28 points 1 week ago (1 children)

nullpointerexception is more likely the developper's fault

Of course it was the developer's fault. But it's absurd a language without pointers throws an error about pointers.

[–] Lysergid@lemmy.ml 17 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I guess naming it NullReferenceException will revolutionize industry

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[–] Lysergid@lemmy.ml 28 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children)

95% exaggeration. Here is reality:

  • yeah you need main class coz it’s OO-language. Though, not required anymore, which should’ve been done once Java got scrip language capabilities (jshell) back in JDK 9. But as of today not required anymore
  • imports exist in most if not all languages. Gotta be insane writing them manually in 2010 let alone 2024
  • installing Java runtime (JRE) is as simple as installing any app. Though for installing JDK you need 5 mins for setting PATH. Think about JDK as like TSC or Webpack and JRE as a Browser. I’d argue installing and configuring JDK is simpler than TSC or Webpack
  • Unless you doing some non-trivial multi-threading your stack trace will tell you exactly where is your NPE. You gotta be as blind as my teammates to spend more than 1 minutes to find where it is coz it literally tells you file and line numer where Exception occurred
  • I mean, yeah if you use IDE from 2000 it will look like it. IntelliJ looks modern, though I don’t like the fact latest versions look like VSCode
  • I hardly reach 3G of deps from all 10 projects I have on my workstation.
  • IDK what anon means by ecosystem here, Java ecosystem is quite standard across the board. JDK(std lib), Maven/Gradle(deps, build, publishing), Spring Framework (all sorts of blueprints and solutions to standard app level problems), Hibernate/JPA (ORM), JUnit+Mockito (testing). These are tools and libs used in 90% of projects I worked on. Of course there will be more depending on project needs. Layers? It’s not like language imposes any layers whatsoever. It’s just common practice to have 3-4 layers and some glue in-between.
  • don’t do GUI in Java it sucks and will suck until Java gets string interpolation. Hopefully soon
  • concurrency is actually the only thing which is really bloated in Java. Which will change with next LTS version if I remember correctly. And it’s not that hard if you actually read the f manual and not just “try and hope”. Again it will become much more efficient and easier to follow soon. As of now - yeah, not trivial. But people mostly prematurely optimize, so karma
  • Java is kinda have 20 ways to do same thing but actually no. Java built with idea of providing simple building blocks. Then it provides more specific API built on top of those building blocks. It allows to have API which solves typical problems and provides capability to solve custom problems with those building blocks. People often confuse this as many ways to do one thing but it’s like saying “I can have byte array why I need string data type”. Those are different levels of abstraction

Edit: typos

[–] rumba@lemmy.zip 19 points 1 week ago

95% exaggeration if he is a real programmer.

If he just tried to walk into Java knowing nothing or maybe PHP, and refused to RTFA, he might experience about 30% to 40% of that I just trying to do everything wrong.

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[–] schteph@lemmy.world 27 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Java is religiously backwards compatible. Modern java projects are not as enterprisey and boilerplatey, but, as jdk21 is backwards compatible with jdk1.3, you can still happily write code as if it's 2003.

Additionally, the java space is huge, so just wildly googling will probably not help you that much.

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[–] chunkystyles@sopuli.xyz 26 points 1 week ago (9 children)

I've been programming in Java professionally for 11 years. It's not just embellishment, it's outright lying.

Threads giving you race conditions? All concurrent programming will do that if you're shit at it.

Java has come a long way. I will admit that UI in Java is terrible. I would never do that.

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[–] darthelmet@lemmy.world 25 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Only have a beginner perspective, but in school I did really well in intro CS class that used Python. 2nd class was in Java and it almost broke me I was so confused.

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[–] Pencilnoob@lemmy.world 24 points 1 week ago (7 children)

It's much better today, but in 2010 that was 100% accurate.

That being said, using Java as a first time programming language is like a 15 year old trying to fly an airliner to get a few blocks away to pick up some after school snacks. Obviously it's way overkill. Sure you could get across town with it, but it's probably 1000x more complicated than just a simple bicycle or even walking.

Java is industrial strength for professionals. There's absolutely no consideration made for educational usage.

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[–] Aganim@lemmy.world 18 points 1 week ago

Anon pretty much sums up my experience with Java when I had to learn it in college 20-ish years ago. I'll never get rid of my distaste for the language I'm afraid.

[–] Valmond@lemmy.world 16 points 1 week ago (3 children)

I have developed in java and C/C++ (many years) and Anon is maybe exaggerating a bit but not lying, we all have been there more or less.

Personally I hate how java forces you into bad architectural choices. Where is the unsigned int? Why isn't an int a class BTW? Why the pass by copy for some, by reference for others? Where is multi inheritance? Lots of things are dumbed down or you have no choice in the matter.

Sure didn't help it was a power hungry beast moving at snail speed back in the day too.

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[–] KoalaUnknown@lemmy.world 56 points 1 week ago (16 children)

Am I weird for liking Java? I feel like it just makes so much more sense than other languages.

[–] Serinus@lemmy.world 52 points 1 week ago (18 children)

C# is nearly the same, but much, much better.

  • It doesn't (usually) come with the Java culture 8 layers of abstraction. This isn't in the Java language. This isn't in OO. Yet nearly every Java programmer makes things way more complicated than it needs to be.
  • It's a prettier language. Similar syntax with less bullshit.
  • It's open source
  • It's still multiplatform. Modern dotnet / C# works on anything.
  • Both Visual Studio and Visual Studio code are great IDEs that blow Eclipse out of the water
  • It's one of the most common business languages.
  • It's going to be supported forever.

If I could restrict the world of programming to two languages, it'd be C# and Rust. C# for most things and Rust for a lower level language.

[–] Kalladblog@lemmy.world 1 points 4 days ago

Isn't Visual Studio Code just a fancy editor and not an IDE?

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[–] sentient_loom@sh.itjust.works 26 points 1 week ago

I like how straight-forward the syntax is. And it also seems orderly to have everything be a class. There's a system to it.

I'm using C++ for a project now and I like it in a similar way, but there's more freedom (everything doesn't HAVE to be a class). So with C++ I'll never go back to Java (unless it's for a job).

[–] chunkystyles@sopuli.xyz 20 points 1 week ago (1 children)

No. Every language has its haters. There's a reason Java is so widely used. If you like it, keep at it.

[–] tempest@lemmy.ca 19 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Yes and the reason is because millions of lines of production code were written and it isn't worth rewriting them.

Plenty of languages around now that don't have 30 years of baggage and the specter of Oracle hanging over it.

Now a days many businesses choose Go.

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[–] AusatKeyboardPremi@lemmy.world 38 points 1 week ago (6 children)

I might have agreed a decade or two ago, when I knew no better. But today, I find the tribalism surrounding programming languages comical.

I don’t particularly like Java, but I use it because it pays the bills. Similarly, I use C++ (which I prefer) when my work requires it.

[–] SorteKanin@feddit.dk 32 points 1 week ago

I don’t particularly like Java, but I use it because it pays the bills. Similarly, I use C++ (which I prefer) when my work requires it.

I mean, anon is not arguing against that. They're saying the language is shit regardless of how much it is used in business. I don't think they are entirely wrong.

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[–] Orbituary@lemmy.world 34 points 1 week ago (6 children)

My old boss is one of the 3 initial creators of Java. He ran our department the same way this greentext reads.

He was also a paedo. You can figure out the rest if you dig.

[–] remi_pan@sh.itjust.works 17 points 1 week ago

Known for : the Java programming language, internet sex crime and the fantasy defense.

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[–] Ab_intra@lemmy.world 30 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Just imagine how it must have been to code Minecraft 🤣

[–] joyjoy@lemm.ee 34 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (4 children)

They only had to deal with LWJGL. The corporate java world has to use Spring.

Edit: They also had to deal with all the fans saying they should've written it in C#.

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[–] Batman@lemmy.world 30 points 1 week ago (1 children)

My inner mathematician respects Java. The first step in any problem is defining your universe

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[–] _____@lemm.ee 30 points 1 week ago (6 children)

C# masterrace and I'm tired of pretending it's not

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[–] jrgn@lemmy.world 28 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Not using Eclipse helps. Using Scala helps even more

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[–] lurklurk@lemmy.world 28 points 1 week ago (14 children)

Hello World

30 minutes of boilerplate

writing imports

$ cat <<EOF > Hello.java
public class Hello {
  public static void main(String args[]) {
    System.out.println("Hello world!");
  }
}
EOF
$ java Hello.java
Hello world!

ok

[–] MooseTheDog@lemmy.world 22 points 1 week ago (6 children)

Welcome to java, we have a couple unconventional ways of doing things, but overall I'm like every other mainstream oo language.

People: AHH! Scary!

Welcome to python. your knowledge of me wont help you elsewhere as my syntax is purposefully obtuse and unique. Forget about semicolons, one missed space and your code is as worthless as you after learning this language.

People: Hello based department

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[–] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 18 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (5 children)

Python:

print("Hello world!")
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[–] babybus@sh.itjust.works 26 points 1 week ago (7 children)

If it took anon 30 minutes to write hello world in java, programming is not for anon.

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[–] WormFood@lemmy.world 17 points 1 week ago (8 children)

object orientated programming is the wrong idiom for almost all problems, and even in the few cases where it makes sense, you have to be very careful or it'll hurt you

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[–] sentient_loom@sh.itjust.works 15 points 1 week ago

You're not stuck with it Anon. You can use something different!

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