It's not superhero fatigue or franchise fatigue. It's bad writing fatigue. Seriously, I don't know why Hollywood keeps choosing terrible writers for huge projects, but as long as they are doing that they are going to keep getting what they deserve.

And speaking of huge projects, from what I've heard Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny cost $295 million to make rather than 250. And that's not counting publicity and marketing, which brings it to 400 million if not more. That means they need to make at least $800 million to break even. No matter how you slice their opening weekend, they are in huge trouble. And given that Elementals and The Little Mermaid both bombed hard along with most other Disney movies of the last few years, I'd say that Disney is in serious trouble too!

On the other hand, Guardians of the Galaxy 3 was rather well written, and from what I've heard it did rather well at the box office. Which is just more evidence that if you have a decently-written film the public WILL go and see it. We're just avoiding crap, that's all.

I'll go out on a limb and say that hauling poor old Harrison Ford away from his bong and forcing him at the age of 80 to make shitty movies is tantamount to elder abuse. As for The Flash, coddling wannabe cult leader and mental defective Ezra Miller was just the icing on the cake. The movie was just badly written.

Frantic last minute reshoots and rewrites are a dead giveaway that something is seriously wrong with a production. But that that is happening so often in Hollywood in the last several years is clear evidence that Hollywood itself has completely lost their way. I don't know if they can right that ship, and to be honest I don't much care. If they won't provide people with the good entertainment that they want, eventually somewhere else will. Maybe Bollywood or China.

I think Flash and Indiana Jones flopped because they’re garbage. Spider-Verse was a masterpiece and clearly a part of the shared universe franchise. Guardians 3 is nearing a billion dollars at the box office.

People aren’t tired of franchises, franchises are just generally getting worse. MCU is a mixed bag with some outliers still doing really well. We’ll see if the new phase can keep up with the introduction of new characters that most people don’t know. But I’m honestly not terribly hopeful.

End of franchise films ? Not even close. What I think you’re seeing now is the floor is much lower for franchise films than before (especially with comic book movies). You need more than “it’s a Marvel movie” to have people go out and come see. The top movies of the year are still either sequels to franchises or based on existing IP.

Indy is failing not because it's a franchise, but because the audience for an 80 year old Harrison Ford is not going to the theater.

Flash failed for reasons other than it being part of a franchise. It failed because that franchise is not well liked, and in fact is in the process of being replaced.

Also, Ezra Miller is apparently a giant dick bag, turning off audiences.

I expect Blue Beetle will do worse due to featuring a character 90% of the movie going audience is unaware of, based on characters 99.9% are unaware of. At best people will go "So it's an Iron Man / Spider-Man ripoff?"

Aquaman is the last of this generation of DC movies, hard to tell how it will turn out. The first one was the ONLY ONE of the DC films to hit the big $Billion mark.

Man of Steel - $668M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt0770828/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Batman V Superman - $873M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt2975590/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Suicide Squad - $746M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt1386697/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Wonder Woman - $822M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt0451279/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Justice League - $657M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt0974015/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Aquaman - $1.148B
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt1477834/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Shazam - $367M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt0448115/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Birds of Prey - $205M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt7713068/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Wonder Woman 1984 - $169M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt7126948/?ref_=bo_se_r_2

The Suicide Squad - $168M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt6334354/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Black Adam - $393M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt6443346/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Shazam: Fury of the Gods - $133M
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt10151854/?ref_=bo_se_r_2

The Flash - $245M and counting:
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt0439572/?ref_=bo_se_r_1

Edit I should say, both Birds of Prey and the Suicide Squad deserved better. Victims of covid and day/date streaming.

WW84 can die in a fire though.

I don't think it has anything to do with being franchise films. Studios just need to make good films and people will see them.

Spider-Man made 600m WW so far which isn't too shabby. That has to contend with superhero fatigue as well as franchise fatigue.

i would love to see revivals of old franchises go the way of the dodo. i am as nostalgic as any millennial but if i want to see indiana jones or ghostbusters or whatever, i'll just watch the originals.

i don't think the superhero franchises are going anywhere, unfortunately. they are still reliable, even with some people losing interest over time. it seems like a good moneymaking bet for disney at least. and all the studios seem really risk-averse lately, more than they used to be.

There are only two good indy movies and that's raiders and the last crusade.

Anything else was crap and crap Indiana Jones movies are nothing new.

Dune and so on are objectively good movies even though they play the hobbit tactic with dune releasing only half the book.

Why people like avengers and marvel and these movies I have no idea. Only a select few of these movies are watchable.

I don't understand the apathy for Indiana Jones. It was a great film. Very entertaining and fun and was dedicated to the previous films. Some very touching moments. Maybe people want to wait until it comes out on a streaming service rather than watch it on the big screen. The big screen experience was worth it with lots of action scenes and Harrison being de-aged and fighting Nazi's, what's not to love.

I heard bad things about the last Indiana Jones, so I won't see the latest one as I would feel like I was missing out on something. Same goes with the Flash... the films don't come across as independent from each other so I won't bother if it seems like I need to have followed the franchise until that point.

I don't think people are sick of the same old stuff. Indy flopped at the box office on the combination of a disappointing 4th movie and Disney's trend of virtue signalling over good characterization and storytelling.

The Flash has the baggage of an unlikeable lead actor, plus the DCU is still all over the place and constantly rebooted. I honestly have no idea what to expect from the Flash, given previous DCU movies.

Nah movies are too expensive now. I'm super excited for indy. He's my hero but the theater is a horrible money waste.

They need to learn to release straight to streaming instead of Theatre only. Because I spent a while lot of money on a 5.1, 65in 4k TV and awesome lighting to go blow $100 every time I want to see a new release? Hell no. The threater is just more irrelevant then ever when I can be super comfy and watch or be packed in with 100 strangers.

No, Indiana Jones is a terrible example to base those on. It's a franchise who's last good film was in the 80s and most people hated the last attempted comeback.

Slightly off-topic, but didn't they claim something along the lines of "people will ignore that Ezra is a total piece of shit because of how great the movie is"?

I think the audience is simply being smarter with their money. A bunch of recent franchise movies have missed the mark and the audience is saying as much.

Super Mario
Dune
Across the Spiderverse

All franchises. But they have so far given their target audience what they've wanted.

Why go see Flash when it'll show up on Max (or whatever) same with Indiana Jones which will be in Disney+ soon enough.

Could this be the beginning of the end for franchise films?

We can only hope.

'The Flash' and Other Mediocre Movies Won't Stop Superhero Fatigue - Variety. Fifteen years (since Iron Man), for the love of Stan! As Scorsese said, "…that’s not cinema…the closest I can think of them…is theme parks."

Fun fact: did you know that the (then) new distribution strategy invented for the iconic film The Godfather gave rise of the Blockbuster (and thus "franchise movies") and the near-death of auteur cinema?

!moviesnob@lemmy.film

Genuine question, how do you know Indians jones flipped hard ?
I went on imdb and it is rated around 7 which isn’t bad at all.

Every time a sequel or a comic book movie lands on its face, someone rewrites an article about franchise/superhero fatigue. And that's been going on for over a decade.

People will show up to watch a good movie. Guardians 3 did really well. Spider-Man is the "same old stuff." This is all cherry picking examples. Movies don't do well when they're bad or the star is unappealing somehow.

Hollywood will stop making these movies when people stop paying to see them.

For a sec I thought Indiana Jones and Flash was one title