this post was submitted on 09 Apr 2024
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[–] DdCno1@kbin.social 183 points 7 months ago (22 children)

There's a new application-layer Internet protocol like (but also very much unlike) http by the name of Gemini. It was first launched in 2019 and until yesterday, flew completely under my radar. It's primarily meant to be used for uncluttered text-only pages (although any type of file can be distributed), which are created using a deliberately simple and limited markdown language. Unsurprisingly, this results in a plethora of small niche blogs being published through it.

The basic user experience is essentially the same as browsing the web, until you notice just how much it isn't. You enter URLs (except that they start with gemini://) you read texts and you click on hyperlinks - except that every page looks exactly the same due to the markdown language. There are no pop-ups, no ads, nothing autoplays, nothing wants your consent to exploit your user data. Even images only load when the user clicks on them. It shows just how little is actually needed, how many aspects of the modern web are completely unnecessary and mere pointless distractions.

Gemini pages - and this is a small hurdle that will keep most people away from it - can not be accessed with a normal web browser and instead require a specialized client for viewing (although paradoxically, creating pages often requires a web browser, at least for now). The idea is that both the underlying tech and the browsers are much more straightforward than anything related to http and html. A Gemini client is not effectively an entire operating system of its own that can execute near arbitrary code. It displays formatted text with basic images and videos - that's it.

Here's a neat, but slightly outdated introduction that also recommends a few clients and where to find pages to read:

https://geminiquickst.art/

The entire thing feels very early, tiny, experimental and odd, almost like a parallel reality, as if the World Wide Web didn't exist and someone came up with something like it only now, using today's hard- and software. If Lemmy is a response to social media in general and reddit in particular, Gemini feels more like a response to the World Wide Web as a whole or like a time machine back to a highly idealized version of the early days of the information system (the primary difference being the lack of horrendous '90s UX design and malware everywhere), including some unfortunate aspects that I had long forgotten about, like how the common method of finding content next to feeds - manually updated indexes instead of search engines - is plagued by dead links; and these dead links, unlike on the normal Internet, cannot be attempted to be resolved using the Wayback Machine or some other cache, at least not yet.

Gemini is equally parts exciting and promising, like a new frontier, but also at times confusing and frustrating. Don't expect your Gemini client of choice to replace your web browser any time soon (or ever), but it's still worth trying out, if for the novelty alone.

[–] teawrecks@sopuli.xyz 24 points 7 months ago (3 children)

I was initially interested in the idea of Gemini, but when looking for a client, I happened upon this blog post by the creator of one of the clients about why they were abandoning it.

After a lot of thinking, I’ve realized there is one main reason I don’t keep coming back to Gemini: it offers no advantage over how I already use the Web.

In practice, the Web already has all the Gemini content I’m interested in from various people, and then of course everything else. Having everything in one place (whether my web browser or feed reader) makes for a much nicer experience.

Gemini is a reaction to bloated modern websites, but in fact I don’t actually visit that many gross websites like that. When I do, my ad blocker and paywall bypasser usually make them decent again. Otherwise, I spend the majority of my non-work Internet time on lightweight sites like my feed reader and Hacker News, and some time on sites that Gemini can’t emulate: YouTube, Reddit, Discord. The reality is that Gemini just wouldn’t actually improve this experience for me.

These are exactly the reservations I had about the concept, so to have someone so invested in it reach this exact conclusion and leave it made me decide to forego it. I think it's a neat toy, and if it becomes relevant I'll definitely take another look, but I think it's a bit of putting the cart before the horse. I don't want to use a protocol for the sake of using a protocol, I want it to serve a purpose and solve an actual problem I have.

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[–] AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world 18 points 7 months ago (7 children)
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[–] Hjalamanger@feddit.nu 11 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I have seen Gemini before but never tried it. Maybe i will but i do have a few questions first:

  • Is there a Gemini search engine?
  • Is there support for Forms/server side code
  • How big is it? Is there like just a few sites or a few hundred?
[–] DdCno1@kbin.social 21 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Is there a Gemini search engine?

I've found this one:

gemini://geminispace.info/

Needs a client to access, of course. Basic, but functional. I found a general-purpose forum not too different from reddit or lemmy through it (and they decided to call it a BBS, because the Eternal September hasn't happened to Gemini yet):

gemini://bbs.geminispace.org/

Is there support for Forms/server side code

To the best of my understanding (and it's highly limited, since I only just learned about this, so take everything with a grain of salt), what Gemini does is primarily limit what the client can do. No local scripts, highly limited markdown. The server side is not limited. You can write any complex code you want that works behind the scenes - but it still has to deliver static pages (called "capsules") to the end user. This series of articles explains the basic underlying tech and uses the example of a simple server to illustrate how Gemini works:

https://medium.com/erus-encodia/creating-your-own-gemini-server-part-1-what-is-the-gemini-protocol-cf497477c4d

And yes, forms are possible, even though there appears to be a somewhat widespread misconception that they are impossible. Please excuse the sketchy-looking IP address instead of a URL, this was the best resource I was able to find on this (and yes, I checked if this page is on Gemini - this appears to be not the case):

http://216.218.220.144/tutorials/sig-tutorials/misc/gemini-forms.gmi

Screenshot if you don't want to click on the above link: https://i.imgur.com/s2mL3bM.png

Disclaimer: This is two years old and I have not tried to implement it myself. Looks entirely plausible though.

How big is it? Is there like just a few sites or a few hundred?

According to the search engine linked above, there are 2420 domains and 1,854,666 individual pages as of yesterday. This is about comparable to the World Wide Web at the same time 1994, a number that grew to 10,000 by the end of that year; I wouldn't expect the same explosive growth from Gemini - the field has already been plowed, after all. Gemini Space is small, but not a ghost town.

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[–] AbsurdityAccelerator@lemmy.world 10 points 7 months ago (5 children)

This sounds cool, but the name is unfortunate due to Google's gemini

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[–] Interstellar_1@pawb.social 78 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

Ferrero (the company that owns Kinder, Nutella and Ferrero Rocher) controlled one quarter of the global production of hazelnuts in 2014.

(Edited to remove some unintentionally deceptive language)

[–] SorteKanin@feddit.dk 28 points 7 months ago (10 children)

That's way too much for one company. Is it just me or does the world just keep making more and more monopolies?

[–] Zagorath@aussie.zone 64 points 7 months ago

That's how capitalism works.

[–] altima_neo@lemmy.zip 16 points 7 months ago (1 children)

It's just deceivingly worded. It's not like they took that much out of the total supply, taking away from others that would have needed it. Reality is that hazelnut farmers were farming them in order to sell them to Ferrero.

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[–] oxjox@lemmy.ml 71 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Major sporting events are a popular time for men to schedule a vasectomy because they're advised to take it easy for two to three days after the procedure. For most men, this means sitting on the couch in front of their television, and sporting events offer them something to watch while resting.
https://www.michiganmedicine.org/health-lab/why-more-men-get-vasectomies-during-march-madness

[–] jol@discuss.tchncs.de 15 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I find it hard to believe young guys still plan any aspects of their lives around watching sports events.

[–] Croquette@sh.itjust.works 14 points 7 months ago (4 children)

Not everyone lives in a busling city with lots to do. For some, sport is one of not many outlets, so it becomes almost like a religion

[–] oxjox@lemmy.ml 12 points 7 months ago

Ummm... as someone who lives in Philadelphia, I can inform you that young men who live in and around this bustling city have adopted sports as their primary religion.

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[–] starman@programming.dev 66 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)
[–] Brad@beehaw.org 22 points 7 months ago (2 children)

I thought your post said NASA at first, and I was really skeptical.

[–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 17 points 7 months ago (1 children)

They install backdoors on their spaceships though :p
Would be highly tragic if the astronauts only had a single exit.

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[–] BallShapedMan@lemmy.world 56 points 7 months ago (32 children)

Traffic (the book) says most Americans merge into traffic wrong when lanes reduce (from say 3 lanes to 2 lanes for example.)

The right way is waiting until you are at the very end of the lane that's reducing. When that happens up to 60% more cars per hour get through the bottle neck in heavy traffic and accidents resulting in killed or serious injury are reduced by up to 80%.

Bottom line having multiple entry points in a queue with multiple slow down points due to the multiple entry points is the cause of the reduced performance with the way most Americans do it.

[–] toomanypancakes@lemmy.world 16 points 7 months ago (4 children)

But, if I merge as soon as there's space for me I don't have to stress and panic about not having room to get into the other lane or keep driving forward. What do you do if you get to the end of the lane and people aren't letting you in?

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[–] callouscomic@lemm.ee 15 points 7 months ago (5 children)

And you tell other Americans this and they think you're rude. "No, you need to merge as soon as you can, that's rude to drive all the way to the end!"

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[–] corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca 11 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Does the book mention that the Zipper merge is inherently flawed as it relies on drivers to be far more cooperative than they are?

Yeah. So, like communism, the entire theory breaks down when humans are actually involved.

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[–] kambusha@lemmy.world 51 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Australia has the largest feral camel population.

[–] Tolookah@discuss.tchncs.de 23 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Interesting fact, but what came to mind for me was camels, dumpster diving like raccoons, running away when the driveway light turns on.

[–] ace_garp@lemmy.world 12 points 7 months ago

They are chill when you drive past them.

They can be a hazard for vehicles if in an accident, because of their size. Think moose size.

The main feralness is that they can smell water, and will head to water-mills to get a drink. They destroy water tanks and pipes to get access. Can't blame them, the outback is hot.

Also can outgraze native animals for grasses and shrubs.

Water-mills look like this:

[–] Dasus@lemmy.world 46 points 7 months ago (11 children)

A rat, a cat, a dog, a person, a human, a horse and an elephant all piss with a full bladder,

Who finishes first?

Weirdly enough, according to science, it's the same time for every mammal to urinate (except really small ones like mice because liquid dynamics starts behaving differently, surface tension etc).

https://www.theverge.com/2013/10/19/4855076/the-law-of-urination-mammals-take-21-seconds-to-pee

[–] Mwallerby@startrek.website 39 points 7 months ago (1 children)

A person and a human? So if a legal person like a company pisses it still takes the same time, neat

[–] Dasus@lemmy.world 22 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

Oh lol.

I woke up like 3min before writing that, hahahaha

Good catch

But I would contend that I know quite s few human who I wouldn't necessarily call people and quite a a few non-people I definitely consider worthy of personhood

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[–] ivanafterall@kbin.social 44 points 7 months ago (4 children)

Earlier today I learned the voice of Shredder from the original Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles cartoon was Uncle Phil from Fresh Prince. I never knew.

[–] Lath@kbin.earth 19 points 7 months ago (2 children)

I knew. Then I forgot. Now I know again.

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[–] Pat_Riot 42 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Hummingbirds eat mosquitoes.

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[–] Mwallerby@startrek.website 41 points 7 months ago (2 children)

The word "asteroid" literally means "star-like", because when they were first observed, no telescope could see enough detail to know what they were, so they were basically just called "those things that look a bit like stars".

Even when eventually we figured out what they were, they were generally considered to all be spherical like tiny planets (see: The Little Prince) until the 1970s when one of the Mars probes flew close enough to have a look at one.

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[–] Corno@lemm.ee 38 points 7 months ago (4 children)
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[–] Corkyskog@sh.itjust.works 38 points 7 months ago (7 children)

Did you know the infinity sign is called a lemniscate?

[–] ComradePorkRoll@lemmy.world 23 points 7 months ago

That sounds like a setup to a deez nuts joke.

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[–] Gradually_Adjusting@lemmy.world 35 points 7 months ago (10 children)

Reagan made it legal to use cartoons to sell toys by deregulating marketing to children, according to the recent Wizard and the Bruiser episode

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[–] ICastFist@programming.dev 27 points 7 months ago (7 children)

Watching historical stuff on youtube (I download and watch during my commute), today I learned how the Portuguese managed to get a very firm hold on the western coast of India in the early 1500s. The TLDR version is that they managed to get the cities that were vassals of Calicut under their wing, and even managed to fight off a massive siege the raja of Calicut sent to destroy their small garrison at Kochin in 1504: a 50k strong force was beaten by a garrison of 90 Portuguese soldiers + ~200 local Nayar warriors + 3 Portuguese ships (1 carrack and 2 caravels).

Before it got to that part, I also learned that Vasco da Gama, who led the initial demands on Calicut, was a short tempered psycopath and violent maniac hell bent on teaching "those muslims" a lesson.

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[–] shinigamiookamiryuu@lemm.ee 25 points 7 months ago (3 children)

All mammals with a full bladder pee for precisely 21 seconds. Legit universal rule.

[–] Someonelol@lemmy.dbzer0.com 23 points 7 months ago (4 children)

I tried recreating that experiment with my dogs over several months and can confidently say they pee anywhere from 7 seconds to almost a minute.

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[–] yournamehere@lemm.ee 24 points 7 months ago (7 children)

baltic sea is the youngest ocean of the planet.

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[–] billgamesh@lemmy.ml 21 points 7 months ago (3 children)

Ball jars are made by Newell Brands. Ball makes spaceships now instead

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[–] xilliah@beehaw.org 20 points 7 months ago (2 children)

When a quantum wave function decoheres, it doesn't precisely collapse into a singular state. Instead, it transitions into a more restricted superposition that resonates with the environmental conditions, effectively integrating into a more intricate quantum system.

This implies that not only individual particles are in a state of superposition, but the entire universe exists in such a state. However, this superposition is so extensively constrained by interactions and entanglements that, at a macroscopic scale, the universe behaves according to classical mechanics.

ELI5: Imagine the universe is like a giant game of pretend where everything can be in many stories at onceβ€”like a cat being both awake and asleep in its adventure, or a ball that’s both rolling and still. But, as soon as we peek to see what’s happening in the game, everything picks one story to stick to where the cat is either just awake or just asleep, and the ball is either rolling or not. But, the game is so big and involves so many things that, most of the time, it seems like everything is following simple rules, like in a regular game, even though underneath, it’s still playing pretend with all the possibilities.

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[–] LaunchesKayaks@lemmy.world 11 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Monotremes don't have stomachs. They got a weird tubey thing.

[–] jol@discuss.tchncs.de 15 points 7 months ago (5 children)

Stomachs are just tubey things with extra steps.

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