this post was submitted on 20 Sep 2023
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Work Reform
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A place to discuss positive changes that can make work more equitable, and to vent about current practices. We are NOT against work; we just want the fruits of our labor to be recognized better.
Our Philosophies:
- All workers must be paid a living wage for their labor.
- Income inequality is the main cause of lower living standards.
- Workers must join together and fight back for what is rightfully theirs.
- We must not be divided and conquered. Workers gain the most when they focus on unifying issues.
Our Goals
- Higher wages for underpaid workers.
- Better worker representation, including but not limited to unions.
- Better and fewer working hours.
- Stimulating a massive wave of worker organizing in the United States and beyond.
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I see good perspective on each end of this...
Perhaps a compromise would be a set amount per mile from home to work? For example just say like $0.65/mile.
Thoughts?
I'm here to tell you that seeing "good perspective on each end of this" can fuck right off. Yes I'm going into full on asshole combative mode, and I am here to tell you unequivocally that you may go and fuck yourself!
And to eloquently point out why, I'm going to carefully explain why the employer side can eat shit: We have a massive climate change issue, and having workers commute is exacerbating on so many levels. Even if we electrify the transportation entirely with carbon free sources, there's still a tremendous environmental impact issue by way of the public transportation or the car production itself. One of the best ways to mitigate this is encouraging remote work WHENEVER POSSIBLE! I realize pilots, EMT's, and firefighter's won't have this luxury but if all the office workers are working from home, this removes a huge amount of congestion from our roadways, decreases the non-carbon pollutants resulting in dramatic air quality increase, improves emergency service response times, reduces the fucking taxes we have to pay on transportation infrastructure maintenance, and a host of other psychological benefits.
We have a huge pay gap - CEO's are making hundreds of times more compensation than their average worker, and the time involved in commuting EVEN FURTHER dilutes the "amount made per hour". If I have an hour commute each way, I get to take my day's pay and stretch it over two more hours. What could anyone possibly have an issue with that for? Oh I don't know, childcare? A dentist appointment that requires additional burned time off? This is why people call scabs motherfucking shithead scumbags. BuT tHe EmPlOyEr iSn'T ReSpoNsiBle, bull fucking shit. The employer chooses to be in some shitty downtown location so the uber rich CEO can walk from his cocaine penthouse to the HQ. For the life of me, I see this happen time and time again where HQ's bitch and moan about attracting talent but they position themselves in some fucked up location where they don't compensate even a fraction of what they should so their employees could afford housing.
We have a mental well being crisis - people are treated like shit and trampled on enough as it is. Many companies take this indifferent approach and focus solely on the business itself, with little to no regard for the people that make it successful. People are spending hours every day commuting instead of looking after their own personal well being. Commute times cut into exercise, family time, self actualization, and pretty much everything people care about.
The best way to mitigate this is by being on the clock from your front door to the workplace. As it was well put elsewhere here in the comments, fuck you, pay me. I will get the world's tiniest violin out for the employer side of the argument and then stomp on with heavy work boots. Then I'll light it on fire and piss on the goddamn ashes. Fuck the employer's argument.
Well said.
I think the primary issue though is that it incentivizes businesses to only hire people who live nearby. On the one hand that’s good because it’s good for the environment, but on the other hand it means I can’t decide to move further away from my employer without risking being fired. This is a bigger problem if your house has multiple working adults.
We could mitigate that by forbidding companies from firing employees who move further away but stay within some reasonable distance, but that then creates an incentive to move as far away from your job as possible to make that extra income.
So, how do you compensate employees for their commutes without restricting where they can live or creating an adverse incentive?
I don't think that would work for most companies. The education demands at this point make it impossible to get all the knowledge worker/white collar jobs you need from a 15 mile radius, unless you're in the middle of a city. They'll be able to hire exclusively local for their blue collar positions -- but they already do that anyway. Companies would not pay thousands for relocation from far away states if they could fill the position easily locally.
I think the workers, at least white collar, really hold the cards here.
Unbelievably based. You want me to be in an office because you think it's more productive? Great. Pay me for everything involved in that switch and I'll do it. Oh, it's more expensive? Boo fucking hoo.
Clearly
A petty thing to bring up, like a scab would.
Your hostile antagonistic rant makes me doubt that you'd change your attitude for a 25% raise*. Seems like you're just really angry in general and I doubt if I'd even want to work around you anyway so I agree you should stay at home.
I'm extremely antagonistic, yes, especially toward scab motherfuckers that have helped get us into the housing crisis, healthcare crisis, and climate crisis. You're also right that I spit at a 25% raise, 40% motherfucker and then I stop using such harsh words.
Does not equal
I think you're gonna be a toxic person no matter what and I wouldn't want you anywhere near my team with your attitude anyway. Stay the fuck at home.
Scabs can fuck off, and you sound awfully scabby there like you’ve licked a lot of boots to get where you are….
Then please, pretty please, stay the fuck at home too. I knew a bunch of people preferred WFH for practical reasons and to avoid commuting but holy fucking shit I never knew there were so many straight up toxic maliciously antisocial people out there who need three weeks to prepare for any kind of human interaction even if it's just "hey jim take a look at this once in a lifetime situation most people will never see outside of a textbook." This place is horrific, I'm blocking this community and might leave lemmy entirely, holy shit.
You better block a lot more than Lemmy. The workforce is sick of executive boots stomping on our necks. There are good employers out there, I acknowledge that, but they're the exception not the rule from the way corporate America functions. To me they seem as rare as drops of water in the Sahara. Until employers start giving some dignity back to the worker en masse, expect things to get a lot more hostile.
For now it's just nasty language, soon it's going to be molotovs and worse. Eat the rich.
You're in dire need of a xanax. Blocking you and this awful place, what a bunch of lunatics, goddamn.
Lol, tell the UAW strikers they all just need a xanax. It's nothing to be upset about, just their livelihoods and futures are at stake. If only we had xanax back in 1937, or after the Pinkertons shot and killed people for picketing.
Where's the block button again? Oh there it is.
Your point is completely moot unless they talk like this at work, and you'd be surprised how well the angriest and unhappiest employees can fake everything being okay. It's an expectation when you're hired after all -- do whatever management says with a smile. Well, you'll get a smile, but you aren't going to control the thoughts behind it.
Besides, I don't terribly like the idea of being paid to comply and fall in line like a good little drone. I value my self worth and dignity at better than a +25% raise. You should too.
Otherwise, I'll give you +27% to apologize to everyone you've insulted and then put a sock in it.
They probably aren't walking around dropping F bombs everywhere but attitude problems like this tend to stand out in my experience.
Depends on a lot of things but yes. A compensation based on distance is good
In Debmark we get "driving deductable" (not sure about the translation)
Thats also some cents per kilometer, after a certain amount of km. If you live super close you get nothing. And you get more if you live far away too.(if you live in certain munincipalities you get more)
It also doesnt matter how you get to work. Bike, train, bus or car. Its based on distance using google maps navigation iirc (or some similar tech)
This couldn't possibly create scenarios that employers only allow employees from a set distance. Live inside the circle and you're good, outside and sorry you can't have a job.
Or they could let you do remote work...
You are literally bringing the argument; if we change things, thing will have to change or there will be problems...
See my other comment
When my job that I did covering at other locations, the company would pay me per mile to get there. It was in 2007, and they paid $0.55/mile. I think with inflation that should be much higher now.
I think that was a calculation that was just gas and wear on the car.
Did you also get paid for the time you spent traveling?
No that was the entire reimbursement
That would encourage people to work further away from their home, increasing commutes and lowering productivity further.
If anything, we should do the opposite - lots of small office spaces spread out among high density housing. Enable in-person collaboration with a much shorter commute.
Edit: Wow, didn't expect this to be controversial. Anyone care to explain?
Or, work from home. Why do we even need to commute to sit in a different chair and look at a different screen?
Sure, that's fine too. Not sure how companies paying per commute distance helps you with that, but whatever.
Why would it need to? That's kind of the point.
it would lead to a dystopian always available, need to work where you spend your nonwork time etc...