The law governing the exemption for seminary students expired last year, but the government continued to allow them not to serve. The Supreme Court ruled that in the absence of a new legal basis for the exemption, the state must draft them. The ruling also barred seminaries from receiving state subsidies if scholars avoid service without deferrals or exemptions.

The waivers also have wider economic impact. The ultra-Orthodox make up 13% of Israel's 10 million population, a figure expected to reach 19% by 2035 due to their high birth rates.

The conscription waiver keeps some of the community in seminaries and out of the workforce, hindering economic growth and placing a welfare burden on middle-class taxpayers.

Israel's 21% Arab minority are also mostly exempted from the draft.

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[–] iByteABit@hexbear.net 66 points 4 months ago

Can't run fascism without a quality meat grinder

[–] tactical_trans_karen@hexbear.net 65 points 4 months ago (2 children)

These people are pretty fanatical about JUST studying the Tora... And they're going to give them guns and training... What could go wrong?

[–] Vampire@hexbear.net 55 points 4 months ago (1 children)

surely you can't pull a trigger on the Sabbath

[–] Crucible@hexbear.net 59 points 4 months ago

It's a subject of debate among normal Jewish people, but for most zionists it has been settled since the Maccabees. You can't 'start' a fight on or just before shabbat, you can 'finish' a fight that is ongoing, zionists just consider the war on Palestine and Arabs generally to be an ongoing defensive war so they can skip any holy days they need to

[–] ZWQbpkzl@hexbear.net 51 points 4 months ago (1 children)

They demoed some military units made up of just these ultra-orthodox. The outcome was they did such blantant and heinous crimes in the West Bank that the US recognized their war crimes and blacklisted then from using any of their weapons.

[–] SteamedHamberder@hexbear.net 1 points 4 months ago

Yes. You are referring to the “Netzach Yehuda” (Victory of Judea) battalion. It was sanctioned by the amerikkka government under the Leahy law.

[–] SteamedHamberder@hexbear.net 59 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I’m of the “let them fight” belief on this one. Secular ethnostate vs. cloistered patriarchal religious fundamentalists.

[–] Vampire@hexbear.net 5 points 4 months ago (5 children)

I disagree. Ultra-Orthodox Jews aren't harming anyone, leave them be. They're peaceful folk.

[–] healthkick@hexbear.net 87 points 4 months ago

United Torah Judaism and Shas are some the most right wing and virulently ethnonationalist parties in the Knesset. Bullshit they aren’t harming anyone.

[–] CommunistBear@hexbear.net 77 points 4 months ago (1 children)

They're just choosing to practice it in a violent fascist state in which they're one of the beneficiaries?

[–] Awoo@hexbear.net 13 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

It was just 5% in 2002.

At least two thirds of these people were born there in the last two decades and likely have exactly the same barriers to choosing to live somewhere else as any of us in trying to leave wherever we might currently be stuck.

If Israel ends they likely wouldn't be kicked out of the new country either, they'd be welcomed to the new state unlike the settler generations, particularly as part of their religious beliefs is to actively oppose the existence of a Jewish state at all.

[–] regul@hexbear.net 14 points 4 months ago (1 children)

part of their religious beliefs is to actively oppose the existence of a Jewish state at all.

Not true of all orthodox. Plenty of orthodox jews in Israel are zionist. Some are just opposed to the secularity of the current state and would have no objections to an orthodox religious state in Palestine.

[–] Awoo@hexbear.net 3 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

Orthodox and ultra-orthodox are not the same jews. The ultra-orthodox are Haredi Jews and are rarely zionist. The only Haredi that support zionism are the Chardal to my knowledge.

[–] SteamedHamberder@hexbear.net 2 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I’m seeing a lot of Breslov and guys among the protesters preventing the aid trucks from getting to Gaza. Now, these a likely Ba’alei t’shuva based on how they are dressed. And there are some messianic Chabad flags too.

[–] Awoo@hexbear.net 1 points 4 months ago

I would not put it past Israelis to be cosplaying as an op or an attempt to swing more of these groups to zionism. If there are infiltrators in our crowds doing ops there are infiltrators in theirs as well.

Not saying that it explains all of them but the general rarity of this among the ultra orthodox makes me think there's something ratty happening.

[–] Diuretic_Materialism@hexbear.net 70 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Ultra-Orthodox Jews aren't harming anyone

Well except for the women within their communities

[–] SteamedHamberder@hexbear.net 23 points 4 months ago

“Extremely High Birthrate”

“Child Marriage”

same-picture

[–] GlueBear@hexbear.net 48 points 4 months ago

Common misconception. The truth is you can't gauge a person's support for Israel by how religious they are, because it isn't a question of religion it's a question of race and colonialism.

[–] LaughingLion@hexbear.net 13 points 4 months ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netzah_Yehuda_Battalion

Think again. They aren't like the Amish or Mennonites in America. These people are not pacifists. Even the USA recognizes their warcrimes and illegal settler activity. I repeat, the crimes of those who do serve are even recognized as wrong by the fucking USA. Think of how brazen and awful those crimes must be for the USA to be like, "fuck okay, hold on for a second...."

[–] Awoo@hexbear.net 52 points 4 months ago (1 children)

The waivers also have wider economic impact. The ultra-Orthodox make up 13% of Israel's 10 million population, a figure expected to reach 19% by 2035 due to their high birth rates.

Holy shit.

[–] hello_hello@hexbear.net 67 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

When I was in high school my zionist peers absolutely hated these people. Like they would be called freeloaders who were piggybacking off of society who were going to replace the secular israelis and ruin Israel's reputation.

Funny to see how fascism works.

[–] marxisthayaca@hexbear.net 46 points 4 months ago

Israel destroying itself speedrun any %

[–] Yor@hexbear.net 43 points 4 months ago

Can't fight in two conflicts without bodies to spend!

[–] Evilphd666@hexbear.net 42 points 4 months ago

I hope this marks the facade of a "Jewish" state to the rest of the Israelis. Don't have a lot of hope but it's another drawing back of the curtain of the fascist hijackers running the place.

[–] Frank@hexbear.net 33 points 4 months ago

sicko-yes

[–] robot_dog_with_gun@hexbear.net 24 points 4 months ago

how do they feel about fragging?

[–] Vampire@hexbear.net 19 points 4 months ago

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israel-supreme-court-rules-religious-seminary-students-must-be-drafted-military-2024-06-25/

[–] regul@hexbear.net 12 points 4 months ago (1 children)

The ultra-nationalist orthodox parties are a pretty big part of Netanyahu's coalition right?

By all accounts he's going to be ousted after they finish bombing Gaza (this leaves open the possibility that he is never ousted), but I wonder if Bibi still feels the need to throw them this bone and pass a new exemption.

[–] RyanGosling@hexbear.net 4 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

I believe it’s largely secular nationalists, but they use religious zealotry to mask their language and intentions and justifications, so they still depend on the religious

[–] RyanGosling@hexbear.net 5 points 4 months ago

God this is gonna be so funny if Netanyahu faces the same fate as Ngo Diem. Not that it’ll change much, but at least the CIA will throw me a bone in these trying times.