this post was submitted on 09 Dec 2023
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Students were required to address ‘whiteness’ and describe what the term ‘white’ means, as well as explain how they ‘navigate race’ in their daily lives.

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[–] Vodulas@beehaw.org 37 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Wow, what a garbage article. Surprise surprise it's origin was Fox News. The amount of sarcasm quotes is kind of impressive, though.

Gods forbid you have to take a look at your privileges then unpack what that means. Oh, and then you have to try and empathize with people that don't have those same privileges. Scandalous.

[–] scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech 11 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Not that having privilege personally is a bad thing either. It's just opening you up to it, being aware of it. It also doesn't diminish other negative things you went through.

I'm a white male. I probably have gotten jobs that were helped by that fact. I also grew up dirt poor only affording ramen and rice. One does not cancel the other out, it just adds to who I am.

However now being aware of it I want to move into a position where I can help change things, where I can help hire people not based on their skin color or sex

[–] Vodulas@beehaw.org 10 points 11 months ago

Exactly. Right wingers are so afraid of admitting they have any privilege. Like, it doesn't make you a bad person inherently

[–] snooggums@kbin.social 5 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I also grew up dirt poor only affording ramen and rice.

If nothing else, we can acknowledge that choosing to eat Ramen and rice now is not the outcome for a lot of people who tried just as hard as we did to move up the economic ladder. They are often still stuck in the same position because of things outside their control.

[–] jarfil@beehaw.org 5 points 11 months ago

tried just as hard as we did to move up the economic ladder

Topple the ladder.

The ladder is bad, no matter where you are on it, or how hard you try to move up.

[–] roastedDeflator@kbin.social 7 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

Wow, what a garbage article. Surprise surprise it’s origin was Fox News. The amount of sarcasm quotes is kind of impressive, though.

I totally agree about what you say on fox news. I would honestly like to ask you something. Since I am not a native english speaker I am afraid that I must have missed the amount of sarcasm you mention. Would you mind pointing out a few examples so that I have a compass for the future. And I will delete it afterwards.

[edit: I was looking for a better article on the topic but I didn't find one yet. If anyone has something in mind, please add a comment and I will edit the post and add this link, instead of deleting it as mentioned above]

[–] Cagi@lemmy.ca 12 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

Any single word in quotation marks. Reread sentences with any single word in quotes as if some conservative know-it-all is rolling their eyes and scoffing at these quoted terms. Putting them in quotes quarantines them from having to be taken seriously and is setting them up for criticism. If they didn't use quotes for terms they didn't like, they might be accused of being complicit in the "woke mind virus" that has stupid people so terrified.

[–] roastedDeflator@kbin.social 8 points 11 months ago

Got it, thank you so much.

[–] Vodulas@beehaw.org 9 points 11 months ago

Looks like some gave you a good explanation. For the record, it didn't seem like you posted it in bad faith, just that the writer clearly had an agenda. You probably can't find any other articles mentioning it because it really isn't much of a story, even though it is cool. The right wing is just trying to rile up their base

[–] PotentiallyAnApricot@beehaw.org 26 points 11 months ago (1 children)

This is really cool. It is actually really useful to be taught things that will help you navigate the world better. Lots of people just don’t get this information at home and tumble into adulthood without it. I’m really grateful that when I went to school about ten years ago, many of the intro classes included units about privilege and race. I remember the experience as being more like “oh crap, I didn’t realize that, now I have a bit more information about how to to act more in line with my preexisting values in the world and be wayyy less weird socially” and not “oh no it is bad to be privileged!”. I imagine that is what it’s like for most people. Fearmongering aside. Lots of people just don’t get parented or educated about this so schools have to do it. It’s helpful. It’s useful. I know many of these articles are supposed to make it seem shocking, but it’s not, it’s just telling people things they might not have realized in high school. It’s a good thing and it isn’t new at all. It’s just that this terminology has entered the public conscIousness and made some people mad. I’m really glad not all schools have caved to this weird reactionary disingenuous repression of what are honestly important life skills

[–] jackkellett@kbin.social 1 points 11 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I agree with you. I think it's a good thing to do to understand the world and yourself better. And for someone such a writing task can sound strange, useless or offensive, but I think it's a good one. I also need to write on different topics, and it helps me to learn new things and understand the world better. Sometimes I use https://essays.edubirdie.com/write-my-essay because for some papers it's very hard to find information, and the time is limited. But if I had such a task, I'd have been very interested in doing some research and writing about it.

[–] Kwakigra@beehaw.org 8 points 11 months ago

I think this is the perfect kind of class for undergraduates attending American Universities. A class which directly challenges students' pre-existing biases and lays out contemporary arguments so that the class can have a shared understanding of what they're discussing whether they are supportive or opposed to those arguments. I was challenged like this when I was in college outside of class and having to directly consider these ideas among people I really repected helped me immensely in my understanding of American culture dynamics and ability to use reason when facing difficult claims.

[–] millie@beehaw.org 8 points 11 months ago (1 children)

So we're just posting Fox News articles on Beehaw now, huh?

[–] Vodulas@beehaw.org 3 points 11 months ago (1 children)

The article is terrible, but OP clarified that English is not their first language and they did not catch the BS it conveyed.

[–] millie@beehaw.org 4 points 11 months ago

I feel like that's not a good reason to leave it up.

[–] jarfil@beehaw.org 5 points 11 months ago (2 children)

I navigate my "whiteness" by covering it in clothes... then getting treated dismissively by doctors because I "have plenty of resources", "have your family help you", "just change your whole life or you'll be dead in 5 years", and "have you already stopped with those silly ideas?".

Thanks for the privilege, by the way.

[–] PotentiallyAnApricot@beehaw.org 18 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

I think this is a good example of how people can be oppressed in multiple ways (medical gaslighting, ableism, financial class, fatphobia, low wages, etc) without one of those ways being racism. The world is still garbage for many white people, but not because of racism. Talking about privilege is not a way to say that all white people are doing perfectly fine, just a recognition of the ways that being white protects one from racism specifically, and from the economic or other social effects of racism. (And what a big difference that make even if we don’t realize that) But not from all isms, and not from all difficulties. Saying someone has a certain privilege is not meant as a way to dismiss their other problems, it’s just supposed to be a neutral way to talk about how different people get treated differently on a sociological level for different reasons. People can have white privilege but not economic privilege, or straight privilege but be sick, or any combination of traits that affect their life and how they are treated. I really hope that you can find a more respectful doctor.

[–] jarfil@beehaw.org 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

It's not just being oppressed in different ways (I've got my dose of xenophobia, fatphobia and ableism), but getting oppressed because of being "too privileged". It's no longer a privilege when you get it thrown at you at every step, when no matter who, they use this or that of your "privileges" to put you down.

And ironically, racism is also a problem for white people, but because some people seem to assume that being white means you must be racist, so they discriminate you for that.

As for doctors, I forgot about the neurologist who kept repeating "It's all in your head" and dismissed me by saying I should get some therapy. When I complained to my GP, she pulled up my history, and it turned out he wrote that he examined me and found nothing wrong. If by "examined" he meant that he saw me sit in front of him while he kept insulting me, then sure.

I've also been told several times that I "have many resources", which seems to be code for "you're so privileged already, you don't need anything".

[–] PotentiallyAnApricot@beehaw.org 4 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I understand and don’t doubt that this is really painful. And it’s awkward as hell to navigate assumptions some people might make because of certain privileges you have - that’s shitty. But it’s not racism, or similar to racism. It’s not oppression (related to a power structure that is woven into societal institutions), it’s mean behavior. People are being assholes to you, and some of them might (? Did they say that, or did you assume?) be claiming inaccurate watered down interpretation of the sociological concept of privilege as an excuse, but this is very different than racism, which comes with a whole mess of legal, historical, legislative, state backed, institutionally sanctioned, violence and does not really depend on interpersonal interactions. It’s not to take away from the things that happened to you, it’s just a different thing. The structure of society’s institutions in many countries is oriented to favor white people, even as individual interactions that white people have in the world can easily be cruel or negligent. I’m sorry that people have been dismissing your needs and that you haven’t been able to get good medical care without being gaslit or talked down to (me too!). But that is not anti whiteness. (Though it might be misogyny or ableism) It’s a failed medical system making excuses to hide its own lack of resources. People kind of suck, many institutions suck. Racism, though, is a very very specific form of oppression that white people just do not experience. This is also true with money. Oppression goes far beyond being condescended to by professionals or having people make sarcastic comments about your finances. Rudeness is not oppression. Your problems are very real and you deserve help and compassion for them. But they are not caused by your whiteness or your privilege.

[–] jarfil@beehaw.org 1 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

I see where you're coming from, and I thank you for your words, but after reflecting on this whole thread, I've come to realize that, with very few exceptions, the people I've met in life have been one or more of:

  • Entitled privileged assholes
  • Jealous of my entitled privileges
  • Thinking I was a fool or crazy for not exploiting my entitled privileges
  • Seeing everything I did or said as an attempt at exploiting my entitled privileges

It suddenly explains all the interactions that left me baffled at the time, and it makes me sick. Maybe I've been just unlucky, or bad at seeking out people who don't fit any of those, but at this point it makes me want, more than ever, to leave and not look back.

[–] FZDC@beehaw.org 12 points 11 months ago (2 children)

I'm healthy, fit, educated, and kinda rich. I'm also a man.

Do you believe those circumstances grant me with privilege?

The answer is obviously yes, so I'll acknowledge it, rather than try to change the subject to ways in which I'm not privileged. Bringing up ways that white people may not be so privileged doesn't actually address whiteness as privilege.

And privilege isn't even something to feel guilty about. It's just worth acknowledging in a "know thyself" kind of way.

[–] jarfil@beehaw.org 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Bringing up ways that white people may not be so privileged doesn't actually address whiteness as privilege.

What about ways in which "being privileged", turns out to actually be a hindrance?

I used to be a healthy, fit, educated, not poor, not homeless, white, tall, man, blonde, with blue eyes... oh, and high IQ.

Wait, did I just describe the Aryan ideal? Ultra-privileged, right?

What pisses me off, is that after being aware of those privileges from relatively early, and being really careful to never abuse any of them, when it turns out that I need help, instead I get my privileges thrown in my face.

It's not a privilege to get mocked and laughed off by doctors, to get failed by teachers, to get your work destroyed, to not get believed about family problems, all because "you're privileged".

Heck, I once almost got run over by a car, because I nodded at a black girl to let her pass first, and she went off her way to hit me with the stroller with her baby inside, pushing me off the curb into traffic. Like, seriously?

So what, did I live my life wrong? Should have joined some neo-Nazi group? Should have used my privileges to abuse and scam everyone left and right? Should have kicked the baby...? The fuck.

[–] roastedDeflator@kbin.social 3 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Do take a look at the following video. You will find answers, if that's what you are looking for.

How to recognize your white privilege — and use it to fight inequality [18:26]

[–] jarfil@beehaw.org 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

That seems to say you should use all your privileges all you can, "but for the good"... while trying not to use them, striving for actual meritocracy, is the wrong way?

Yeah, in retrospect those might be wise words, in a "when among wolves, bite first then be good later" sense, but I find it kind of shitty as a goal for society. Oh well.

[–] roastedDeflator@kbin.social 1 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

You are talking about the introductory text of the video. If you read it once more, you will see that what you mention in your comment is not relevant. Anyways, the important stuff are in the video.

I suggested the Ted talk because one can see her process, since she came to these conclusions thanks to self-reflection and thoughtfulness.

If you prefer reading, here is the text:
White privilege: unpacking the invisible knapsack - Peggy McIntosh