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Excuse me, René (mander.xyz)
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[-] hakase@lemm.ee 121 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

The worst part of this comic is that philosophy bro is clearly not even very good at his field, since there's a much better Cartesian parallel to be made here (and I'm not even a philosopher).

"I think, therefore I am" is actually leaving out (imo) the most important part of Descartes's argument. He was trying to find literally anything that he could know without a doubt was true. The problem is, that's really hard, as our existence-troubled shopper has discovered. Descartes could doubt the existence of God, he could doubt the existence of goodness, of truth. All of these things might not actually exist. Descartes could even doubt his own existence.

In fact, literally the only thing Descartes could conclude without a doubt was true was the fact that he was doubting at all. So, since that's the only thing he could be sure of, that's what he built his argument for rationalism upon.

This perfectly mirrors the existential crisis the so-called philosopher comes upon, but instead of starting the shopper right where Descartes started, he instead just provides what must seem like almost a non sequitur in context, since if the man is currently doubting his existence, he can also doubt that he's thinking. What he cannot doubt, is that he is in fact doubting.

"I doubt. Therefore, I think. I think, therefore I am."

[-] 5redie8@sh.itjust.works 15 points 5 months ago

In a sea of garbage, this is actually one of the most interesting things I've read on here. Thanks mate.

[-] leftzero@lemmynsfw.com 11 points 5 months ago

But what if you're just imagining or dreaming that you're doubting..? How do you even know you are the thing that's doubting..? "You" could be a spurious Boltzmann brain, randomly manifested out of quantic chaos, in a state resembling that of a person doubting their own existence, for a mere Planck instant before dissolving back into the chaos from whence you emerged...

[-] Mr_Blott@lemmy.world 5 points 5 months ago

Guys stop. "Doubt" is starting to look funny

[-] ineffable@sh.itjust.works 6 points 5 months ago

Semantic satiation

[-] xthexder@l.sw0.com 3 points 5 months ago

In the grand scheme of things, a human lifespan is in the same ballpark as a Planck instant when considering an infinite universe. That doesn't mean either are insignificant in their own context though.

Time can be infinitely subdivided For all we know, billions of entire universes could be created and destroyed within ours in an instant. Our own universe could be as insignificant as an atom in some higher level universe. We can't know that. But what I do know, is that I exist in this moment, and that's enough for me.

Slightly related is the anthropic principle, or the "observation selection effect", which is nicely summarized by this analogy:

This is rather as if you imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, 'This is an interesting world I find myself in — an interesting hole I find myself in — fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!' This is such a powerful idea that as the sun rises in the sky and the air heats up and as, gradually, the puddle gets smaller and smaller, frantically hanging on to the notion that everything's going to be alright, because this world was meant to have him in it, was built to have him in it; so the moment he disappears catches him rather by surprise. I think this may be something we need to be on the watch out for.

  • Douglas Adams, The Salmon of Doubt

The takeaway I get from this is that it's important to appreciate the time we have, since everything comes to an end eventually.

[-] JackGreenEarth@lemm.ee 1 points 5 months ago

Yes, all you know is that something exists. And for the sake of argument, we call that 'you'.

[-] ChefKalash@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 5 months ago

I could be any of these things, but I would still be

[-] doctorcrimson 3 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Yeah I was gonna make a similar argument.

The proof of one's existence is only that they percieve it enough to question it. Unfortunately, all of our sensory data is unreliable proof and therefor we cannot prove there is anything other than our own conciousness. Maybe you're a mad god trapped in an eternal nightmare of your own design, have fun with that concept.

[-] BlanK0@lemmy.ml 2 points 5 months ago

I couldn't have said it better

[-] Evilsandwichman@hexbear.net 0 points 5 months ago

Damn, you really forget sometimes what life was like before therapy.

[-] Peppycito@sh.itjust.works 29 points 5 months ago

People made this joke about my art degree (textiles) but I've had a career for 25 years and my mortgage is about to be paid off in April. So, eat a dick 🫳🎤

[-] Rachelhazideas@lemmy.world 19 points 5 months ago

I'm happy for you, but real question: would you recommend this degree to aspiring students? Would you say you're the exception or do people have the wrong perception about a career in art?

[-] Peppycito@sh.itjust.works 8 points 5 months ago

Absolutely I recommend it. It teaches analytical and critical thinking and gives you space to develop physical skills. It may not lead to a career as a fine artist but it absolutely has transferable skills. I didn't need to go to art school to become an upholsterer/marine fabricator but I draw on my education daily. I'm a far better designer for the experience.

Keep in mind, I'm not talking about an art history degree.

[-] TurboHarbinger@feddit.cl 22 points 5 months ago

Dude's insane. Cats don't fucking talk.

[-] Sabre363@sh.itjust.works 13 points 5 months ago

What do you mean? Of course cats talk. They tell me to do all kinds of things, but I try to ignore them, sometimes, maybe . . . .

[-] Zerush@lemmy.ml 16 points 5 months ago

Descartes was not right, most people do not think and yet they exist unfortunately.

[-] gornius@lemmy.world 5 points 5 months ago

Actually the negation of that implication would be: "I think, and I don't exist", and not "I don't think, therefore I don't exist".

[-] IDontHavePantsOn@lemm.ee 12 points 5 months ago
[-] leftzero@lemmynsfw.com 9 points 5 months ago

Oh! Oh. I’m sorry! This is abuse. No, you want twelve. Next door.

[-] IDontHavePantsOn@lemm.ee 2 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Don't tell me what I want, and don't tell me you're sorry. Do you think I actually came here to abuse people? Do you think I'm that fucked up? Are you trying to tell me what to think? I know what happens next door, and you're not going to get me involved with that weird sick shit that you're clearly involved with. Maybe that would fly with your other friends, but it's not going to here. Why don't you just take your weird sicko bullshit next door and tell them about my abuse huh? Yak it up with all your sick ignorant friends, and pat each other on the back while crying abuse. I'm sure you'll all have a really fucking nice time. Really. Go ahead and have a good time. Is that what you want to hear? Because if I say anything otherwise I'm the fucking asshole right? Well fuck you. I'm done. Got it? I'm done.

[-] JayDee@lemmy.ml 4 points 5 months ago

I won't argue with you till you put some pants on.

[-] IDontHavePantsOn@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

I'll consider it when you give me a better option than to call you moron.

[-] JayDee@lemmy.ml 2 points 5 months ago

I won't argue with you; I am unequivocally a moron.

[-] firecat@kbin.social 6 points 5 months ago

According to the thought experiment of Schrödinger's cat, the animal can’t talk but also can speak.

[-] acastcandream@beehaw.org 3 points 5 months ago

Boomer humor

[-] frozencat@sh.itjust.works 2 points 5 months ago
[-] bouh@lemmy.world 2 points 5 months ago

And then we're surprised fascism is rising...

[-] otp@sh.itjust.works 1 points 5 months ago
[-] bouh@lemmy.world 3 points 5 months ago

The cat is the teacher.

[-] exocrinous@lemm.ee 1 points 5 months ago

Reality is fake.

this post was submitted on 13 Jan 2024
645 points (96.4% liked)

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