this post was submitted on 26 Jan 2024
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Animal liberation and direct action
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- 18 Theses on Marxism and Animal Liberation
- Racism as Zoological Witchcraft: A Guide to Getting Out
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- The Death of Nature
- The Case for Animal Rights
- Anarchism and Animal Liberation
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- The Unbearable Whiteness of Milk
- Speciesism as a Precondition to Justice
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- Citations Needed on media portrayals of animal rights activists
- The Jungle
Vegan 101 & FAQs
- Black Vegans Rock resources page
- Animal Rights: The Abolitionist Approach FAQs
- 30 Non-Vegan Excuses & How to Respond to Them
- Guide to justifications for harming and exploiting animals
- Your Vegan Fallacy Is
- The Radical Left’s Top 10 Objections to Veganism (And Why They Suck)
- Animal Liberation Front FAQs
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hey you want to eat some imitation baby? It tastes just like the real thing!
That’s how you sound
damn that's some pretty good imitation baby
I'd absolutely try imitation baby
That's just moralizing for no reason. Meat eating has been a part of most of the world's cuisines for a very long time, so having substitutes to help more people transition is a very good idea. This point has been repeated a ton of times, but many people are ND and can't change their habits very easily, or have texture / taste sensitivities
sure, but the point stands. for a lot of us, the idea of eating animals is gross. it is a viscerally disgusting thing. we don't eat animals not only because it is wrong but also because it is disgusting. the idea of eating stuff that is intended to be as close as possible to something disgusting is not appealing in the slightest.
and the comment is not "moralizing." no one is saying it would be evil to eat imitation baby. it's just ... why would you want to?
I don't eat animals because it's wrong. They tasted great to me on the day I stopped. It's true that my taste has changed as a consequence of not eating animals - after a restaurant miscommunication I discovered that butter tastes weird now - but focusing on that is counterproductive for external messaging. Carnists eat flesh and think it tastes good. You can't convince them that it tastes gross and trying to do that will have you dismissed as a picky eater.
what fucking external messaging this is !vegan@hexbear.net, an explicitly vegan forum where carnists aren't allowed to post on a website where being anti-vegan is explicitly against the rules. this is internal chatter, not external messaging. we're not talking to carnists, we're talking to each other. stop jumping down people's throats for speaking as though carnist brain is not the default
The reason I'm vegan is to get other people to do it. This comm isn't invite-only; carnists see it on Hexbear and in federated servers, and carnists come in and comment all the time. It's fine that you personally are disgusted by the taste of flesh, but that has no moral weight. Transpose it slightly: a lot of tomatoes are picked by slaves. If we were trying to organize a tomato boycott we wouldn't want "tomatoes taste like shit" to be widely agreed on by boycotters. In fact we would want to discourage that talk, to prevent people from saying "you guys don't care about slavery you just don't like tomatoes". And it would be frustrating for boycotters to constantly hear others in the movement go on about how tomatoes are disgusting and how could anyone include that garbage in their meals to begin with, while they're busy trying to make some pathetic bell pepper red sauce.
Idk I mostly want to uncouple the correct moral outrage at production from how stuff actually tastes. When carnists ask me if I miss meat, that's an opportunity to say "sure, but it's really important to not eat it" not "nah I never liked it anyway". Maybe I'll feel differently in a few more years; right now when I hear someone say they're viscerally disgusted by like, seitan because it's sort of vaguely like meat, I find it hard to believe.
No one said it did. In fact I explicitly said it doesn't. Who in the world are you talking to?
I'm talking to you and your defense of this original comment:
This is obviously a moral claim. They're not saying imitation baby would be gross because baby flesh tastes gross. I'm sure it doesn't; veal is eaten across the world. They're saying it'd be gross because you're not supposed to eat babies. Similar arguments are made against BDSM play that simulates harming others. To defend it, you wrote:
The obvious answer is it tastes good; these are the foodways we were brought up with.
If the taste of meat has no moral weight, why bring up your "visceral disgust" for it? Why would /u/worldonaturtle compare it to baby flesh? If it has no moral weight, then who cares? I don't like lion's mane mushrooms, if somebody was promoting a lion's mane sub to reduce lion's mane farming deforestation* I simply wouldn't have anything to say. Good on them, wasn't my problem to begin with. Nobody gives a shit whether I happen to like the mushrooms, especially those people who are working on a substitute, and going on about how I think it's viscerally disgusting would be needlessly antagonizing.
*I assume this is not a real problem
Actually a funnier example is music. Meat is Murder was a good album but Morrissey sucks and they're making a lab grown Morrissey. You think Morrissey sucks but you only listen to folk punk anyway? Well fuck off lol, who cares
Okay but seriously though, there are a lot of things that are 'imitations' of things that are morally repugnant that are not only harmless but enjoyable due to the fact that no one is getting hurt from it. Like violent video games, some sexual roleplay and so on.
It's less 'we are imitating the animal harm hooray' and more 'we took the animal harm out of this thousand+ year old human food tradition, hooray!' (or twenty+ year old if it's the fast food stuff lol)
they should make an imitation human baby called "humane baby"
they can call it Unborn Baby
????
I’ll sound like that once they make imitation baby back ribs
Please go outside. You seem mighty starved of nature, the place where plants like veggies and grass grow aplenty.