this post was submitted on 21 Aug 2024
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Masked police officers in Romania carried out fresh raids early Wednesday at the home of divisive internet influencer Andrew Tate, who is awaiting trial on charges of human trafficking, rape and forming a criminal gang to sexually exploit women.

Romania’s anti-organized crime agency, DIICOT, said it was searching four homes in Bucharest and nearby Ilfov county, investigating allegations of human trafficking, the trafficking of minors, sexual intercourse with a minor, influencing statements and money laundering. The agency added that hearings will later be held at its headquarters.

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[–] Barbarian@sh.itjust.works 116 points 2 months ago (4 children)

Fun fact about our legal system: we don't do jury trials. The evidence and arguments are heard by the judge, who decides both guilty/not guilty and the sentence.

[–] SGGeorwell@lemmy.world 41 points 2 months ago (3 children)

That’s a terrifying fact about your legal system.

[–] TheFriar@lemm.ee 79 points 2 months ago (6 children)

Well, it could be depending on how robust their anti corruption practices are. Because what really makes more sense, 12 citizens, uneducated in law and its application, getting manipulated by differing levels of millionaire depending on the wealth of the defendant/plaintiff? Or a legal expert weighing the facts to determine their strength?

Because, both are open to corruption. The jury of your peers is open to corruption in the ways I’m sure most people on lemmy are familiar with, but the other way, with robust anti corruption laws, would arguably be better.

[–] Barbarian@sh.itjust.works 40 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

There's also the fact that appealing a judgement goes to more judges, always different than ones who have seen the case. Basically:

1st judgement -> 1 judge

1st appeal -> 2 different judges (must be unanimous)

2nd appeal -> 3 different judges (must be unanimous)

This makes corruption less common, as getting 6 different judges to all risk their career for a bribe is unlikely.

I'm not going to claim this system is perfect. There are issues with the fact that there is no mechanism for preventing enforcement of an unjust law. If it's on the books and it's an open-shut case, the law will be applied no matter how unjust it is. The inverse is also true though: you can't have unjust rulings that ignore laws the other direction, for example jury nullification of the murder of a black person (used to happen all the time in the US).

Like most things, it's a tradeoff. Some things are better, some are worse.

[–] Duamerthrax@lemmy.world 10 points 2 months ago (2 children)

It would be easier and cheaper for an elite to bribe a hand full of judges then it would be to repeatedly bribe different sets of jurors.

[–] Barbarian@sh.itjust.works 8 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Cheaper? Maybe. Easier? No, not really. Ion Popescu from Bumfuck, Nowhere doesn't have the DNA breathing down his neck, watching for any signs of living outside his means and any unusual bank account activity.

EDIT: To be clear, I'm not saying corruption doesn't happen. It does. I'm just saying it's not automatically much worse than juries.

[–] Duamerthrax@lemmy.world 5 points 2 months ago (2 children)

We have laws against bribery in the US and it still happens. I'm going to assume that it's at least as bad in Romania considering Tate explicitly stated the corrupt justice system is why he moved there. His biggest fuck up was saying that out loud and forcing them to make an example out of him.

[–] Barbarian@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Like most things law-related, it's more about enforcement than anything else. Things dramatically improved while our anti-corruption force was under the control of Laura Kovesi. She kicked some serious ass. Now things are treading water a bit, but Romania is not quite the kleptocratic corruptofest it was in the 90s. There's always improvements to be made ofc.

[–] ChickenLadyLovesLife@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Tate explicitly stated the corrupt justice system is why he moved there

It remains to be seen whether or not he was correct in that assessment.

[–] Duamerthrax@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

Well, regardless, neither a fair, nor corrupt justice or police force like to be openly called corrupt. Saying that out loud is the smoothest brain thing to do

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[–] barsoap@lemm.ee 16 points 2 months ago

You know what's terrifying? Being judged by people who can't be nailed to the cross for perversion of justice. That is, jurors.

[–] ShaggySnacks@lemmy.myserv.one 2 points 2 months ago

Many different countries have use different methods for trials. Some countries reserve jury trials for serious criminal offences, some give the accused the option of a bench trial, and some do a mix of judges with juries.

Jury trial

[–] velociroger@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

Phoenix Wright moment

[–] Adulated_Aspersion@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

What is the age of adulthood?

[–] Barbarian@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

18, like the rest of Europe.

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[–] saltesc@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago

Hey! That fact wasn't fun at all! Interesting, though...

[–] figaro@lemdro.id 80 points 2 months ago (3 children)

When I think of all the horrible shit that goes on in the world, the thing that keeps me going is that Greta Thunburg is responsible for the Tates getting arrested. Life is wonderful sometimes.

[–] LucidBoi@lemmy.dbzer0.com 21 points 2 months ago (3 children)

I'm OOTL, can you explain?

[–] SpiderShoeCult@sopuli.xyz 41 points 2 months ago (2 children)

legend goes that Greta made the guy mad on xitter and he posted a response that also included a picture of himself with a pizza box, and cops knew where to find him because of the brand on the box, but not sure if it was proven true or not

[–] SkyezOpen@lemmy.world 32 points 2 months ago (1 children)
[–] Artyom@lemm.ee 13 points 2 months ago

Of course the police would deny it. They can't readily admit to browsing the social media of people they want to arrest for info, it would make the technique less effective. The whole story makes sense though, Tate would have been traveling a lot and it would be difficult to guarantee an arrest.

[–] Valmond@lemmy.world 11 points 2 months ago

She also told him off for not recycling the pizza boxes and boom busted. Or so the story goes.

[–] Nythos@sh.itjust.works 9 points 2 months ago (1 children)

IIRC Tate tweeted at Thunberg something about his cars, and in that photo was a pizza box of a Romanian pizza place which lead to police knowing he was in the country.

[–] LucidBoi@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 months ago

i remember that haha funniest shit ever.. and then he became a hc muslim because he got scared in prison

[–] Sadbutdru@sopuli.xyz 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I can't remember the details, and too lazy to search it up right now, but I think it was like Greta and him were having a Twitter argument, and he maybe posted a photo with a background that accidentally disclosed his location, so authorities who were already looking to arrest him were able to act on it.

[–] SkyezOpen@lemmy.world 11 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Pizza box with an identifiable store narrowing down his location. Romanian police say the brothers whereabouts were already known due to an ongoing investigation, but the timing of the arrest sure is funny.

https://www.reuters.com/article/fact-check/claims-that-pizza-boxes-in-andrew-tate-video-led-to-his-december-arrest-unsuppor-idUSL1N33O1FH/

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[–] Riccosuave@lemmy.world 15 points 2 months ago

Don't forget to give that fucking moron Adin Ross his flowers too.

[–] ripcord@lemmy.world 6 points 2 months ago

There's a lot more good stuff out there. It just doesn't get articles, clicks, or social media shares.

You see mostly things that get you outraged all the time largely because everyone is addicted to outrage.

[–] Angry_Autist@lemmy.world 26 points 2 months ago

Literally every sane person on social media called this guy out as a pedo 2 years ago.

I can't believe people STILL idolize him...

[–] arin@lemmy.world 25 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Justice is rare and wonderful

[–] aeronmelon@lemmy.world 13 points 2 months ago

Will Ferrell: “Real justice, sooo hot right now.”

[–] ChronosTriggerWarning@lemmy.world 14 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Couldn't happen to a more deserving soul.

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 14 points 2 months ago (2 children)

He keeps getting "caught", put under house arrest, left to his own devices, charges dropped, and then "caught" again.

Beginning to think they're not actually going to sentence this guy

[–] ChronosTriggerWarning@lemmy.world 13 points 2 months ago

"The manhunt for Tate's chin will continue."

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[–] Yawweee877h444@lemmy.world 14 points 2 months ago

Very good.

Lock this fucker up and throw away the key.

[–] hark@lemmy.world 13 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Again?! Throw him in prison already!

[–] nutsack@lemmy.world 4 points 2 months ago

that's the idea, im guessing. they need to build a case first

[–] SkyNTP@lemmy.ml 11 points 2 months ago

An outcome that was on everyone's bingo card.

[–] Live_your_lives@lemmy.world 10 points 2 months ago

Can somebody explain to me why it's taking so long for Tate to get sentenced?

[–] Etterra@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

Good. He's a bad person and doesn't deserve to be happy.

[–] xc2215x@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago

Good move by the police here.

[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

What the fuck is it with famous internet people and kids?

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 4 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Famous internet people are generally willing to exploit people for their own gain. Not all of them, but particularly the most famous and powerful. The ones who aren't usually can't become as large. If you're willing to exploit people for fame, money, and influence, you probably aren't going to stop there.

[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Yeah, but they can't just get bimbos with big fake tits who love them for their money and not their character like a normal rich asshole?

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Do you think normal rich assholes aren't doing this stuff? That's the whole issue with the Epstein stuff. Basically every rich asshole was involved. It takes a certain type of person to become so rich and powerful. Those people tend to like to have even more power over people, which makes minors the perfect target for them.

Never trust a rich and/or powerful person to be good; you'll only be disappointed.

[–] nickwitha_k@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Are you meaning to imply that people with a likely pathological obsession for obtaining and exercising power over others might be driven to seek greater and greater levels of power disparity such as leveraging their position, influence, and money to exploit those who, legally, can have ownership over none of those things and are psychologically and developmentally incapable of informed consent?

If so, all evidence appears to be pointing towards you being correct.

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 2 points 2 months ago
[–] LustyArgonianMana@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago

Chrystal Kizer did nothing wrong.

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