this post was submitted on 10 Oct 2024
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traaaaaaannnnnnnnnns

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Welcome to /c/traaaaaaannnnnnnnnns, an anti-capitalist meme community for transgender and gender diverse people.

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MODERATORS
 

Hi comrades, want to give you all an informal update on the discussions around the site's misogyny problems that've been happening over the last several days. I wanna make sure you know that the admin/mod team has seen all of that discourse and we've been actively discussing solutions in the matrix mod chat. We're taking this shit very seriously and acknowledge that we haven't used a heavy enough hand on misogynistic rhetoric. As some of you saw we nuked that cheating thread from a couple weeks ago and handed out temp bans to the most egregious offenders. Idk how that was allowed to run it's course but we apologize for that oversight. We're going to do better.

We've come up with some ideas for how to improve this part of the site culture and we want to get suggestions from y'all as well, since the alarm was sounded on this by our beautiful c/traa posters to begin with. Our ideas so far include:

  1. A zero-tolerance policy towards any even remotely misogynistic/patriarchal posts or comments, as too much has slipped through the cracks on that, establishing a clear protocol for bans for violating rules against misogyny, and ideally tracking repeat offenders in a way that makes deciding a course of action easy when they reoffend.

  2. Uphold TC69 thought by starting up a book club (and hopefully more to follow) on feminist theory and encouraging mass participation, particularly from the he/him's on the site. "The Will to Change" by bell hooks has been suggested by multiple people as a great starting point but please feel free to suggest any other works.

  3. Relaunching /c/menby with a trusted educated mod team and a specific focus on countering mainstream narratives about masculinity, relationships and sex that breed reactionary, patriarchal attitudes

  4. Encouraging [namely femme] participation in /c/womenby and taking steps to revitalize that sub as an excellent source of discussion on feminism and intersectionality

  5. Holding another mod drive to get more folks into mod positions in our communities who can help weed out reactionary attitudes

  6. Encouraging users to use the report button often on any post that seems even remotely sus, with the promise that no one's going to be punished for "report abuse" for reporting posts in obvious good faith

Please let me know your thoughts on the above or any other ideas you have for making the site better, safer and more inclusive for our femme comrades. Once we've fully hammered out plans and updated policy we plan to make an announcement post highlighting these changes for the whole userbase. Thank you all for being here and being who you are feminism trans-heart

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[–] FunkyStuff@hexbear.net 81 points 1 week ago (33 children)

rat-salute-2

I'd like to kick off a little discussion since this comment about the way Hexbear often assumes the reason women aren't having more children is that material conditions for them are poor, when it actually is the opposite from @Othello@hexbear.net has stuck with me and it's a really important discussion that wasn't really properly addressed/developed in that thread (in fact, many commenters just kinda dismissed the point love made with the exact kinda rote vulgar materialism Othello was arguing against in the first place!)

Maybe it deserves its own thread, maybe the admins/mods should take a look at what happened there, IDK.

[–] Othello@hexbear.net 50 points 1 week ago (4 children)

Goodness I feel flattered. I dont even think I explained myself as well as i could have i was so pissed off from seeing another post or comment hand-wringing about population rates in rich industrialized countries for the umpteenth time. this was actully why i felt the need to take a break from hexbear. and i mean im glad i did ive been touching grass more then ever before and am pissed off over internet things far less (still way too often). actually, i would not have seen this comment so quickly if not notified by my friends. anyway thanks for all the love in this thread yall, very sweet, i shall be off though as the edibles are kicking in and i need to lay down immediately.

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[–] Nakoichi@hexbear.net 45 points 1 week ago (13 children)

I think declining birthrate ( without doing some malthusian eugenics shit) isn't necessarily a bad thing long term.

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[–] aaaaaaadjsf@hexbear.net 44 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (6 children)

Yeah the position a lot of people have on here with regards to birthrates, the position that Othello was calling out, where people think that if you improve "material conditions" more women will start having children, is just not compatible with reality.

In reality, the poorest countries with the worst education have the highest birthrates, while the wealthiest countries with good education have the lowest birthrates. I've also gotten into this in previous comments as well. As materialists, our positions should be based in reality and not vibes, and the reality is very clear on this.

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[–] RedWizard@hexbear.net 42 points 1 week ago

My wife's dad is one of 18 kids. That's unthinkable. My dad is one of like 8 kids, also a unimaginable number of kids. Both were basically in farm country. The conditions under which they had those kids were wildly different then the conditions we live in now. My wife has a degree, her grandmothers didn't, my wife's mom is a veteran and the primary breadwinner in the house, also not true of her mother or mother-in-law. They didn't have those opportunities.

How is someone supposed to achieve any of that if they are literally pregnant for almost 15 fucking years straight? At the time that they were having kids women had only just gained the right to have a fucking bank account. Oral birth control was only just becoming available in 1960. So much of a womens life was under direct control of their husbands. No fault divorce wasn't a thing until 1969. 1970 Reed v Reed ended will discrimination. My youngest uncle was born around the time that women could finally get lines of credit (1974), meaning up until then they couldn't legally own a house. I could go on, or you can just look at the timeline of rights: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_women%27s_legal_rights_in_the_United_States_(other_than_voting)

It's so painfully obvious that it was the lack of independence within the social system that lead to "high birth rates" and that when given the opportunity to do anything other then pump out kids, women chose to not pump out kids.

The entire line of attack on women from the right is centered around reversing the rights they have gained. The goal of that line of attack is to get the birth rate to rise again. Abortion rights is the beachhead, no fault divorce is being whispered about by some right wing psychos. If it was money that made the birthrate go up then that's how they would solve it. The fact that these rights are under siege is evidence that they believe this will make birthrates to up. They've said as much as well. It's not theory or speculation.

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[–] Llituro@hexbear.net 81 points 1 week ago (3 children)

my "shut the fuck up and listen" strategy continues to pay untold dividends

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[–] Infamousblt@hexbear.net 64 points 1 week ago (12 children)

Wow redfash tankie mods won't even let boys be boys soviet-huff

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[–] Angel@hexbear.net 58 points 1 week ago (46 children)

Personally speaking, to give my own insight into another subject that others have discussed in this thread, I am all for a neutral (meaning neither specifically masculine nor feminine-aligned) non-binary space.

Seeing cisheteronormativity and binarism rife on every corner of the internet is deeply exhausting and honestly makes me feel like I'm "broken" for existing in a way that is far beyond any of it.

Not all trans people are non-binary either, so I can't say that I'm 100% confident that enbyphobia/transmedicalism would never "leak," even if just a little bit, into this community.

Truthfully, as inclusive as Hexbear can seem, I don't give any unambiguous trust to anyone who is cis, hetero, white, or neurotypical. The fact that this thread needed to be made in the first place can show you why.

"Leftists" will go mask off and spew hatred towards someone like me when it no longer benefits them to pretend that they're not hateful bigots.

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[–] asante@hexbear.net 57 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (8 children)

woah those are great changes!

very based mod team heart-sickle feminism

  1. Encouraging users to use the report button often on any post that seems even remotely sus, with the promise that no one's going to be punished for "report abuse" for reporting posts in obvious good faith

ayy now i have no report button anxiety

[–] HelltakerHomosexual@hexbear.net 45 points 1 week ago (1 children)

UNLIMITED REPORTS ON THE 1ST WORLD (hexbear)

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[–] Dirt_Owl@hexbear.net 57 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Thanks for trying to do better, Hexbear.

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[–] buh@hexbear.net 53 points 1 week ago (4 children)

Bit idea: transitioning to avoid being purged from hexbear

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[–] niph@hexbear.net 49 points 1 week ago (11 children)

I just read the thread and even though most comments are deleted you can get the flavour of what people were saying. The way that some people are almost gleeful about the prospect of a woman being physically endangered is gross.

I think there might be a difficult discussion to be had about whether there’s a link between some of the more general politically violent rhetoric / fantasising on here and an implication that any violence against perpetrators of perceived wrongs is justified. I would hope comrades are able to distinguish between supporting resistance movements and the violence that’s necessary for the overthrow of capitalism on the one hand, and violence against individuals perceived to have committed some personal moral infraction on the other. But Western and especially Anglo culture is extremely individualistic, and that has created the framework through which many users on this site see the world.

I’m not sure what solutions there are to this, but some self-reflection is likely the place to start.

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[–] AmericaDelendaEst@hexbear.net 48 points 1 week ago

wow im glad i have no idea wtf happened

[–] sneak100@hexbear.net 48 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (25 children)

This is really appreciated; thanks to the mods, and also to all the people having struggle sessions and putting in real life force (energy, time, wellbeing, etc.) into educating their comrades, I see you, appreciate you and commend your effort o7

One thing does stand out to me as potentially worrying, but I do want to hear what others think as well.

I guess I assumed that /c/womenby does already include all enbies and not just "femme enbies", so then does the creation of /c/menby require an exodus of "masc enbies" to a different comm? Why are we doing gender segregation for enbies?

Now as far as enbies go I'm pretty femme I suppose, so I kinda don't think this will be such a big problem for me since I can also identify with the label of "woman" easily enough, but what about our they/thems and agender comrades? "Engage in whichever community you like or both" is one way to go about it I suppose, but I can't help but feel like we're replicating the gender binary here in a way that will make some feel excluded from both comms.

I'm all for having a more active place to unpack gender shit, I think that is sorely needed for our cis he/him comrades, but I guess my instinct would be to go to something like /c/men or /c/mascs (these are not prescriptive :P) and leave the enbies alone? What do others think?

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[–] RagingGingivitis@hexbear.net 47 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

full support on pushing back against misogyny, that thread was a dumpster fire and made me logout for like a week.

dumpster-fire

[–] take_five_seconds@hexbear.net 47 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

hell yeah ban their asses

looks at own pronouns

aw fuck

edit: i liked when tcsex# made us all read, should do it again

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[–] tactical_trans_karen@hexbear.net 47 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Great responsive action! This is why I'd choose the bear. sicko-hexbear

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[–] thelastaxolotl@hexbear.net 46 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Uphold TC69 thought red-sun

Unlimited Purges on reactionaries qin-shi-huangdi-fireball

[–] buh@hexbear.net 45 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (20 children)
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[–] belligerentkitten@hexbear.net 44 points 1 week ago (3 children)

i've seen several comments on this thread to the effect of "pls explain to me why the cheating thread was bad so i can self crit"

and i have misgivings about this. this is not the place for it. i'm glad they're open to reconsidering their perspective and the poorly named comm for deconstructing this shit has been resurrected and that's probably a good place to start. but reopening it in the post about the misogyny purge just kinda derails the actual discussion and expects the people misgyny is directed at to do all the work of educating them.

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