this post was submitted on 20 Aug 2024

464 points (98.1% liked)

politics

19090 readers

4046 users here now

Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!

Rules:

Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.

Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.

Example:

Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.

That's all the rules!

Civic Links

• Register To Vote

• Citizenship Resource Center

• Congressional Awards Program

• Federal Government Agencies

• Library of Congress Legislative Resources

• The White House

• U.S. House of Representatives

• U.S. Senate

Partnered Communities:

• News

• World News

• Business News

• Political Discussion

• Ask Politics

• Military News

• Global Politics

• Moderate Politics

• Progressive Politics

• UK Politics

• Canadian Politics

• Australian Politics

• New Zealand Politics

founded 1 year ago

MODERATORS

outrageousmatter@lemmy.world

aidan@lemmy.world

jordanlund@lemmy.world

HLMenckenFan@lemmy.world

little_cow@lemmy.world

464

Former Trump voter: Trump is ‘lying about pretty much everything’ (thehill.com)

submitted 2 months ago by MicroWave@lemmy.world to c/politics@lemmy.world

87 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Rich Logis, a former voter for former President Trump, appeared in a video message broadcast to the Democratic National Convention on Monday night to say that the COVID-19 pandemic showed him how Trump was “lying about pretty much everything.”

“I believed Trump,” he said. “When the pandemic hit, we needed leadership, but we were given almost nothing. It was a major betrayal to the country.”

Logis described himself as a “full-fledged member of MAGA” and encouraged fellow voters that there was still time to change their minds about whom to cast a ballot for in November.

top 50 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old

[–] Hazzia@infosec.pub 97 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (8 children)

Guys, I know how easy it is to say "lol what a dumbass" about people like this, but as someone who grew up rural it's really hard to express the effect of being completely surrounded by a culture that is still suffering from a generational grief of having industry take their resources and destroy their land, only to then take the jobs away and completely abandon everyone to poverty. Years and years of politicians making promises that never came to pass, or never actually helped those people. Republican talking heads like Fox news took advantage of that and pretended to sympathise with their angst, while riling them up by drip feeding other bits of moral outrage, and just magnified the distrust of "city liberals" and "costal elites" over the course of generations. And we all know about the poor education in rural areas!

No matter how much democrats could tell them what votes are in their best interest, it's really no wonder they wouldn't believe them. Imagine if War of the Worlds actually happened, then 50 years later a martian showed up and told you that you earthings really need to implement this financial system called gronsnockle and it would make your lives so much better (and also that you're just a stupid earthling dumbass who doesn't know what's best for you).

If Donald Trump's bullshit is making cracks in the armor that Murdoch and the Nixon legacy has spent so long shoring up, we should be encouraging that. Does anyone really think that insulting people who are trying to change, is a good way to make more people change??

[–] TrickDacy@lemmy.world 37 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Yeah except I'm from that world and it's not really how you're presenting it at all. The real cause here is an extreme rejection of education. If that wasn't the case, they'd see how Republicans make their lives far harder every time they can. But the truth isn't important to them. Only feeling indignant and continuing with the same false facts they've always worked on.

No matter how much democrats could tell them what votes are in their best interest,

This is what pisses me off. Uh, no, it makes zero sense that they disbelieve obvious facts and cling to nonsensical lies. Being wronged doesn't absolve you of being expected to think

[–] Bertuccio@lemmy.world 27 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (3 children)

OCs comment is basically "All the politicians lied to them so it's totally understandable that they won't trust Democrats... but blindly follow Republicans"

If any of that was true, rural people would dislike all politicians and industry shills, and vote against them. Not consistently favor the ones who screw them more.

It's great that some of them finally came to their senses and maybe will drag others with them, but that doesn't make it acceptable to have doggedly held immoral stances that hurt others in the first place.

[–] MagicShel@programming.dev 27 points 2 months ago

rural people would dislike all politicians and industry shills, and vote against them

That's exactly how Trump came to be President. It's also why they like the message of small government. They are all a bunch of lying assholes, so better to have the smallest government possible. It's a message that meshes with god being more important than country, and with 2A. You've 100% nailed it.

[–] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 16 points 2 months ago

Well one of the parties offers them a petty sense of revenge and no need to change if you’re an asshole, so that seems that’s all it takes to earn loyalty.

[–] someguy3@lemmy.world 5 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

OCs comment is basically "All the politicians lied to them so it's totally understandable that they won't trust Democrats... but blindly follow Republicans"

This is why they liked Trump (the first time anyway). The other Republicans say one thing then do another. They saw Trump as actually meaning it. Course it didn't happen and the ones that see that are bailing.

Trump used to talk a good game, but, well that's it.

[–] ChronosTriggerWarning@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Trump did not "talk a good game." His grift is painfully obvious to anyone that's graduated from kindergarten. Him getting elected is just an example of how stupid a sizeable chunk of this country truly is.

[–] someguy3@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

When you listen to him now and him 8 years ago, you realize he used to talk about bringing back jobs and industry. He doesn't do that anymore. I agree people should have been able to see through it then. But now he relies too much on attacks and he's showing through, so more people can see through it (and from his no results from 4 years, and Jan 6).

[–] Pandantic@midwest.social 3 points 2 months ago

I agree wit both of you - Trump talked a good game for people with little education, presented himself as an “outsider who would drain the swamp” of politicians they have learned to distrust, he “said what he meant” (aka insults and bigotry), and was a “self-made millionaire” (something they all aspire to and believe they could be someday). It was a good grift for the population he targeted, as the original commenter said, angry at industry leaving their towns, angry at politicians not helping. You know what PT Barnum said: "There is a fool born every minute". He said a lot of other applicable things too because he was a successful con man, just like Trump.

[–] jumjummy@lemmy.world 8 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Don’t forget religion. Religion is a cancer that encourages you to just trust what you’re being told despite a complete lack of evidence. Religion is also the cause of these single issue voters, like on abortion, where they will vote R simply on the abortion issue alone.

[–] TrickDacy@lemmy.world 5 points 2 months ago

Honestly though, religion is just their scapegoat. While you're right that it discourages free thinking, I don't know if a single toxic belief they have outside of homophobia, which has any basis in religion. For example, the Bible says nothing about abortion, except describing one in detail once.

They hide behind their religion. Which is pretty sacrilegious honestly. But let's not let them pretend God told them to be horrible assholes.

[–] barsquid@lemmy.world 13 points 2 months ago

Actually it is as if instead of blaming the parties actually responsible for economic conditions, they embrace their bigotry and the lie that immigrants are responsible. All the Repub politicians reinforce that, but don't actually do anything that harms the immigrants. Then someone shows up who calls immigrants "rapists and thieves." They elect him and he really follows through. He changes the conditions at the border to increase the number of illegal crossings. He implements a shockingly cruel policy of separating parents and children, knowing full there aren't resources to keep track of children, so some will be lost.

[–] casmael@lemm.ee 8 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Come on you know gronsnockle is going to improve things all the way up the supply chain, evening out the glansblaarg fees is only going to make smeechickle easier and more cost effective- any earthling could see that

[–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 4 points 2 months ago

I know! Freakin’ glansblasrg fees. Hah? Amirite? I mean . . . Shh.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] Strider@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

I really really want gronsnockle now.

load more comments (4 replies)

[–] kescusay@lemmy.world 92 points 2 months ago

I have a huge amount of respect for people who manage to pull themselves out of the cult and recognize it for what it is.

Seriously, think about how much Logis invested of himself into being a MAGA Republican. These people pour their entire identities into supporting Trump.

Breaking out of it must feel like cutting off their own arm. They've got the sunk-cost fallacy, personal ego, and relationships that are built almost entirely on political leanings working against them.

And they know how they'll be treated by former friends and loved ones, because - to their shame - they know how they treated people who managed to find the exits from MAGA-world.

So a huge amount of respect to Logis for getting out despite the enormous pressure he must have felt to stay in.

[–] Bonesince1997@lemmy.world 47 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Yikes. Then maybe explore how you were so easily duped. That's the real problem.

[–] rockSlayer@lemmy.world 21 points 2 months ago (9 children)

It can happen to anyone. You are not immune to propaganda.

[–] imPastaSyndrome@lemm.ee 24 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Okay but... There's a difference between being influenced by propaganda and actively ignoring your eyes and ears, And going out of your way to be influenced by a cult of personality

[–] rockSlayer@lemmy.world 15 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (3 children)

How do you think cults operate? A cult of personality requires insane amounts of propaganda. The type of propaganda that the largest news network in the country provides. The type of propaganda that is effective at reaching vulnerable and disenfranchised people into believing hateful ideology. There have been many smart people that ended up in a cult, because that cult's propaganda was effective to them.

[–] Zexks@lemmy.world 5 points 2 months ago (2 children)

It also takes a mind unwilling to ask important questions or perform any kind of self reflection. No not anyone is susceptible to this.

load more comments (2 replies)

[–] AmidFuror@fedia.io 4 points 2 months ago

Going out of your way to believe what everyone around you believes? Yeah, that's hard.

[–] samus12345@lemmy.world 8 points 2 months ago (2 children)

You are not immune to propaganda.

"You are not immune to being convinced by something."

Nobody should be immune to that. What they should be able to do is distinguish accurate propaganda from bullshit.

load more comments (2 replies)

load more comments (7 replies)

[–] Carvex@lemmy.world 28 points 2 months ago

No shit? We knew that in the 1990s, how is this news?

[–] jjjalljs@ttrpg.network 27 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Ok, glad he came around to realize Trump is a deceitful fool. My question is what has been learned more generally? Are people like this going to fall for maga2?

[–] samus12345@lemmy.world 24 points 2 months ago (1 children)

[–] Nuke_the_whales@lemmy.world 7 points 2 months ago (5 children)

Bouncing up and down while repeatedly saying yes. Wtf is Skinner doing?

[–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 12 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Explaining steamed hams.

[–] themadcodger@kbin.earth 9 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I'm from Utica and I've never heard anyone use the phrase 'steamed hams'.

[–] Good_morning@lemmynsfw.com 4 points 2 months ago

Before the Simpsons I think nobody had

[–] samus12345@lemmy.world 4 points 2 months ago (2 children)

gifs loop, in case you weren't aware.

load more comments (2 replies)

load more comments (3 replies)

[–] cultsuperstar@lemmy.world 6 points 2 months ago

They either have already fallen for it are never stopped falling in the first place.

[–] Daxtron2@startrek.website 25 points 2 months ago (1 children)

No shit, still your fault :)

[–] Soulg@sh.itjust.works 16 points 2 months ago (12 children)

We should be welcoming the few who are able to say they were wrong and advocate for our side.

load more comments (12 replies)

[–] Etterra@lemmy.world 20 points 2 months ago (1 children)

It's always a mix of emotions when somebody realizes something I've always known since day one. I wish it would stop happening, I hate being right so often, it's fucking depressing. I wish more, however, that other people would be smart enough to know a scam when it smacks them upside the head.

[–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 9 points 2 months ago (2 children)

True. To be fair it’s a ridiculously low bar.

I want to ask him “what gave it away”? The pandemic in his case, apparently. What was that moment like when he was all “heeeeyyyyyy . . . Wait a minute!”

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] xc2215x@lemmy.world 16 points 2 months ago

Good to see from this voter.

[–] henfredemars@infosec.pub 13 points 2 months ago (1 children)

At this point I can't tell the difference between the dementia and the intentional deception.

It's weird that he's running at all in such a mental state when he should clearly be in care of professionals.

[–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

That was the case almost a decade ago and -

gestures to everything

[–] aseriesoftubes@lemmy.world 11 points 2 months ago

Welcome… to the real world.

[–] YurkshireLad@lemmy.ca 10 points 2 months ago

I wonder how many of his friends and family stopped talking to him and how many threatened him with violence.

[–] jballs@sh.itjust.works 8 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Here's a link to the actual video since I didn't see it in the article or here in the comments.

https://youtu.be/9iUg9C-8p2I

[–] DJDarren@thelemmy.club 4 points 2 months ago

I guess he’s really starting to regret voting for Trump then.

[–] snooggums@midwest.social 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (2 children)

Cool, cool. Some moron who fell for Trump's obvious lies and happened to catch on eventually is broadcast at the DNC.

Who is he supposed to be swaying at the DNC? This seems like stupid feel good crap about how "Trump voters can be swayed with logic and reason" when it is obvious this one person does not represent even a tiny portion of the MAGA voting block who are still all in on Trump.

[–] mipadaitu@lemmy.world 7 points 2 months ago (2 children)

This is how communities break out of bad cycles. You show people who changed their minds, and that encourages fence sitters to also change their minds. Then when those people show that they've changed their minds, even more follow.

This is used to push groups towards good polices, and also how mobs get out of control.

If the dems ignore the psychology of large groups, then they'll never get more than a small percentage of the vote.

https://youarenotsosmart.com/2023/09/14/yanss-269-deconstructing-how-minds-change-with-michael-taft/

load more comments (2 replies)

[–] st3ph3n@midwest.social 6 points 2 months ago (2 children)

I'm pretty sure people at the DNC aren't the actual audience, the cable news crowd is.

load more comments (2 replies)

load more comments