this post was submitted on 23 Dec 2024
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[–] JeeBaiChow@lemmy.world 12 points 11 hours ago

Maybe the lack of quick access to life saving resources, procedures and experts immediately after the shooting, aka 'healthcare', was what actually killed him?

[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 84 points 1 day ago (8 children)

This makes me believe it really wasn't him. If he actually wrote a manifesto, he'd have declared himself guilty, taken credit, and done a speech about how he was now a martyr for the cause.

If he's sticking to his story, then I believe him. They couldn't find the real killer so they just went with whoever "fit the description", as per usual.

[–] arc@lemm.ee 3 points 1 hour ago

Of course it was him. That doesn't mean from a legal perspective he is best served by pleading guilty. Pleading not guilty also means he'll get a jury trial and his lawyers can introduce evidence that embarrasses private health insurance providers, or proves his state of mind, or otherwise casts doubt.

[–] FJW@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

That’s now how it works: In the US “justice”-system there are only extremely limited cases where it makes sense to plead non-guilty, because it pretty much just means that you skip the trial and get sentenced directly. Especially if you want Jury-nullification, you have to plead non-guilty so that the Jury can find you innocent despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

[–] Rakonat@lemmy.world 1 points 1 hour ago

What overwhelming evidence in this case? The evidence made public definitely seems to imply he's not the one who shot the CEO.

Why would a person take such a carefully planned route through the city to Central Park, change clothes and dump their bag, only to keep their gun, fake IDs and hand written manifesto/confession on their person three days later while eating lunch at a restaurant? If Luigi was the shooter and looking to take credit as what has been released of the manifesto implies, why hide out for three days instead of publicly turning themselves in after informing the press so it's recorded and likely televised?

[–] Hlodwig@lemmy.world 1 points 4 hours ago

Its obviously NOT him, footage from the murder shows thin eyebrows, white skin (like Irish white) and way smaller dude than Luigi... I still cant understand that people still believe Luigi could be the killer...

[–] Zron@lemmy.world 14 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

Wouldn’t be surprised if he was in New York on some legitimate business, they caught him on camera at a Starbucks near the murder, blasted his image all over the news and social media, and just waited for someone to call.

Then when they got the call, they grabbed a backpack with “evidence” and claimed he had it on him when they arrested him.

Did anyone believe that he was wondering around for 3 days with a bag that was holding the murder weapon, fake IDs, and a hand written manifesto? He ditched another bag, and escaped on an e-bike. Why would he then run around for three days with the rest of the evidence.

[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 7 points 12 hours ago

Either he is the dumbest man alive, or the police really wanted to just go with the first guy who fit the description knowing that they'll look like heroes to their corporate overlords, and that if another guy bites the dust they can just say it was a copycat.

[–] wildcardology@lemmy.world 44 points 23 hours ago (1 children)

Innocent until proven guilty. It's the government's job to prove him guilty. He doesn't have to help them.

[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 10 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

If Innocent until proven guilty, why the fuck do we lock people up to await their court date?

[–] FordBeeblebrox@lemmy.world 7 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 8 hours ago)

Because it makes money, and a splash of long standing racism

[–] Modern_medicine_isnt@lemmy.world 10 points 23 hours ago (1 children)

Personally, I am sad that is all it takes for you to believe something. Businesses, media, governments, and more are trying to make people believe things (unrelated to luigi) that aren't true. You need to raise the bar, not lower it. Maybe you want to believe he didn't do it, but I hope you don't actually believe that based on so little information.

[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 3 points 20 hours ago

There's too much that doesn't add up, it's just too convenient that he had the gun and manifesto on him.

[–] sunbytes@lemmy.world 13 points 1 day ago

I mean, if he can away with it while not undermining his original intentions, why not do it?

There's various ways he could go unpunished that would prevent a retrial and so he'd then be set up to be influential in some kind of healthcare reform.

Heavy on the cope though.

[–] morrowind@lemmy.ml 17 points 1 day ago (1 children)

That doesn't explain why he keeps mogging the camera, or what he yells to the journalist in that one video.

I don't know if it's him, but I think whoever it is, is just following their lawyer's advice, not trying to be a martyr

[–] DeLacue@lemmy.world 15 points 22 hours ago (2 children)

The thing is they've actually made a mistake charging him with terrorism. It is surprisingly narrowly defined so even without a sympathetic jury he might get a not guilty verdict for it and it weakens the whole case against him. But most of all by including it they've made all his intentions and politics central issues to the case. All the evidence and his statements about this will have to go into the public record. If he had pleaded guilty that wouldn't happen nor would there be a chance for jury annulment. Pleading not guilty is simply the smarter option to take.

[–] capital@lemmy.world 3 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

A jury could just find him not guilty on that one count but guilty on all others. Not seeing how it weakens any other part of the case.

[–] sukhmel@programming.dev 3 points 2 hours ago

I think it's along the lines of 'if the prosecution presented an accusation that is obviously false, how well standing is the rest of the case'

If I were in the jury, a case that is part bullshit would definitely compel me to think again about how well the investigation was done

[–] 8000gnat@reddthat.com 5 points 21 hours ago

Hope this is true

[–] Fedizen@lemmy.world 148 points 1 day ago (5 children)

Its fucked up the news is acting like Sandy Hook wasn't a decade ago. All this guy is accused of is shooting a CEO.

[–] phoenixz@lemmy.ca 4 points 16 hours ago (1 children)

I don't really think it's a conspiracy of sorts, it's just news media being news media. They want the most clicks, doesn't matter much what for or what the consequences are. it's the same reason why trump yet again got so extremely much news coverage. Had news organizations all decided not to waste their time with trump, we wouldn't have his presidency now. In reality though, everyone and their mother had to talk about trump, it was trump before and after and now we have yet again to deal with this fuck face for a other 4 years. I know that news media aren't the only ones to blame, theyight now even be the worst, but he'll do they have a large share of the blame for all the shit that had been happening lately, and it's all about the clicks, it's all about the money

[–] ChogChog@lemmy.world 2 points 3 hours ago

Like you mentioned, it’s the biased part of the business which wrestles with journalistic integrity.

ie. Return on Investment, special access or limited access compared to your competitors depending how your piece is written.

It’s not entirely surprising when journalistic integrity is at odds with the finances that fund said journalism, but it most certainly can be disappointing.

[–] papertowels@mander.xyz 11 points 21 hours ago* (last edited 21 hours ago)

This is the disheartening part that highlights the class divide. Shootings of common folk barely make the news where I'm from. How much have taxpayers paid for this so far? Justice clearly isn't being applied equally.

[–] SuiXi3D@fedia.io 51 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Maybe if it happens enough, we can normalize billionaire CEO murder as well.

[–] some_designer_dude@lemmy.world 46 points 1 day ago (1 children)

CEO or not, billionaires gotta go

[–] tdawg@lemmy.world 2 points 10 hours ago

Ya you don't have to be a CEO to hold massive investments across the board

[–] Woht24@lemmy.world 46 points 1 day ago (3 children)

The problem here is the frequency of the crimes. If CEOs were being shot on a weekly to bi weekly average in groups of 3 or more, this crime would become one of the many others the American media wash over.

[–] Reverendender@sh.itjust.works 33 points 1 day ago (2 children)

That sounds like a challenge

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[–] EmpathicVagrant@lemmy.world 56 points 1 day ago

Sandy hook was instead normalized, and happens multiple times over across the nation annually. Pew pew ‘muricuh

[–] alquicksilver@lemmy.world 307 points 1 day ago (10 children)

Speaking to CBS, the BBC's US partner, on Sunday, Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas said that the online rhetoric has been "extraordinarily alarming".

"It speaks of what is really bubbling here in this country," he said. "And unfortunately we see that manifested in violence, the domestic violent extremism that exists."

Did he care about the domestic violent extremism before it started to affect the wealthy? What about the domestic terrorists who go after the queer community, POC communities, women, doctors providing reproductive healthcare...the list goes on.

Violent extremism isn't new here. It's just that this one affects people with power.

[–] phoneymouse@lemmy.world 82 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (3 children)

You’ve got far right militias blowing up America’s electric grid infrastructure, threatening politicians, having standoffs on federal property, and patrolling hurricane impacted areas trying to capture federal employees that are there helping, and I’ve never heard those people referred to as terrorists.

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[–] Zaktor@sopuli.xyz 98 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (6 children)

Yeah, the rules of society say they won and they think all the losers beneath them just have to accept it. The social order and status quo are great for them. That something would violate it is extremely disturbing to them and provokes an emotional response.

I think that's why they seem to be so clumsily overreacting to the murder. Maybe it's working in segments of the population I don't see, but everyone in my social network is either outright happy it happened or at least get why it happened. Some will have perfunctory "murder is wrong" statements, but the thrust is about what a corrupt and evil business health insurance is. That's all the way up to the boomers and crosses political boundaries.

Things like the perp walk, excessive charges, and corporate comedy pretending everyone just thinks Mangione is a bad guy just highlights the us vs. them of class war rather than trying to somehow quell or redirect the bubbling unrest. I think they're doing this because their peers and masters are emotionally demanding a visible and recognizable show of power and obedience. If they knew what was good for them they'd be triple-timing it to make some token effort to reform the system, but even a token effort in response to the killing of a rich person would infuriate them, so clumsy performances it is.

[–] samus12345@lemm.ee 55 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

When my usually "civil" boomer dad said he gets why he did it and wasn't outright condemning him, I knew the ruling class wasn't in control of the narrative as per usual this time.

[–] masterofn001@lemmy.ca 47 points 1 day ago (3 children)

My 75 year old Canadian aunt laughed when I showed her this

Everyone hates these people except the people who want to be these people.

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[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 16 points 1 day ago

Did he care about the domestic violent extremism before it started to affect the wealthy?

No, not at all. They're only mad because for the first time, the elite feel mortal.

You ever heard of the "less dead", well, Brian Thompson is "more dead"

And for those who haven't "Less Dead" is a saying used to describe people who's deaths the police don't look into because they're "not important enough"

Many serial killers get away with their crimes simply because they're smart enough to only kill those who would be deemed "less dead"

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[–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 219 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (16 children)

His lawyer made a great point about how law enforcement and the media threw "alleged" out the window and just insisted he did it...

What's disappointing is it's apparently working because when I do see and "allegedly" thrown in, people are down voting it like it's a conspiracy.

People always want to act like propaganda can't effect them, but the whole country immediately accepted that he was guilty because of a tiny change in reporting from the norm.

But especially with the wrinkle that someone brought it up to the McD's worker and then she snitched....

I think the cop's have a reason they're sure, it's just they got that reason illegally thru means we're not supposed to know they have. Which explains a lot of shit.

[–] laurelraven@lemmy.zip 1 points 17 hours ago

I'm not so sure the cops are actually sure, there are enough questions around how all this shook out, none of it really adds up well, so either they're hiding the evidence that links this shit together, or they're railroading someone who looks like the guy who flashed a smile (who we don't even know for sure is the shooter) so they can look good by closing the case fast and making an example of him.

[–] ramble81@lemm.ee 84 points 1 day ago (26 children)

Frankly I still question if he’s a lookalike scapegoat so the police can save face and try to put it to bed. May also explain the odd “planted” evidence that is being mentioned.

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[–] Reverendender@sh.itjust.works 117 points 1 day ago (1 children)

The terrorism "charges" are laughably flimsy and clearly contrived. Trumped Up, you might say.

[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 26 points 1 day ago

The terrorism charge is absolutely the dumbest thing they did. Now it's on them to prove it was more than just murder.

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