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Pluralistic: “If buying isn’t owning, piracy isn’t stealing” (pluralistic.net)

submitted 6 months ago by Gaywallet@beehaw.org to c/technology@beehaw.org

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[-] IndeterminateName@beehaw.org 118 points 6 months ago

I used to have a moral objection to piracy, I thought that if a piece of media is good enough that I enjoy it then the people that made it deserve to be paid for their work.

I'm increasingly of the opinion that even if I do pay for something there is no guarantee that the people that worked on it will get their fair share and paying for media is increasingly a worse user experience than piracy.

[-] GentlemanLoser@ttrpg.network 27 points 6 months ago

I feel similarly but one of those choices is guaranteed not to help the people you'd like to see helped

[-] mkhoury@lemmy.ca 21 points 6 months ago

I'm not so sure that's true. What if normalizing and removing friction from piracy gets to the point where the streaming services have to react by providing better services and better payouts?

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[-] Steve@startrek.website 21 points 6 months ago

Nor are you likely to get what you paid for

[-] ultra@feddit.ro 14 points 6 months ago

Or to keep it

[-] teawrecks@sopuli.xyz 11 points 6 months ago

On that note, the only relatively convenient exception I know of is Bandcamp Fridays. They're specific days where Bandcamp doesn't take any share of purchases.

I wish this were a more common practice, and I wish I could allocate my Netflix/HBO/prime/etc. subscription dollars to support specific titles. Instead, shows get cancelled because people didn't stream it enough on day 1. I want a s2 of Tales From the Loop, but it's still in limbo with no way for fans to show support.

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[-] JackGreenEarth@lemm.ee 63 points 6 months ago

Piracy isn't stealing anyway. You're not removing the data from the original owner.

[-] shrugal@lemm.ee 24 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

But the original creation cost time and money, which you're not reimbursing the creator for. The moral thing to do is to pay your share of that if you make a copy, even if the copy itself doesn't cost anything.

It's like going to a concert without paying the entrance fee. Sure it's not a big deal if only one person does it, but the concert couldn't even happen if everyone acted like this, or the organizers would have to pay for it all by themselves.

If you want to morally justify piracy then start with the ridiculous earnings and monopolies of big media companies, or the fact that they will just remove your access to media you "bought". Piracy is like stealing, but sometimes stealing is the right thing to do.

[-] MaggiWuerze@feddit.de 16 points 6 months ago

Would you call it Piracy if I lend a bluray from a friend? I didn't pay for it and yet I've watched it.

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[-] Chozo@kbin.social 9 points 6 months ago

How do you feel about jumping the turnstile at a train station?

[-] Prunebutt@feddit.de 29 points 6 months ago

Counter question: Do you think that running libraries is theft?

[-] luciole@beehaw.org 10 points 6 months ago

Public Lending Right programs exist in 35 countries to compensate authors whose works are in libraries.

[-] Prunebutt@feddit.de 10 points 6 months ago

Great! Let's do that for any type of media!

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[-] Vodulas@beehaw.org 28 points 6 months ago

Amoral at worst. Public transportation shouldn't have a fee at use. Tax the rich, invest in transport

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[-] zephr_c@lemm.ee 19 points 6 months ago

Depends on the circumstances I guess, but no matter how I feel about it people jumping the turnstile aren't stealing the train.

[-] sxan@midwest.social 21 points 6 months ago

Are they stealing a ride?

I don't like this analogy, because there's a real, albeit small, cost to the subway of that free ride, in terms of fuel and increased maintenance. Digital piracy has literaly no real cost to the producer except the nebulous "lost sale."

[-] risottinopazzesco@feddit.it 9 points 6 months ago

It should be a free service anyway. Without free public transport, democracy does not exists. Same reason healthcare and education should be. So sure, you are “stealing” a ride - something that should be yours anyway because people are not born with the ability to travel kilometers of cityscapes, something that is now mandatory to survive and thrive.

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[-] jamesravey@lemmy.nopro.be 15 points 6 months ago

I dunno, I mean are the train company allowed to take my money and then go "sorry we fell out with the fuel company so we're just gonna keep your money and not take you to your destination. Soz babe x"

[-] r00ty@kbin.life 10 points 6 months ago

You wouldn't download a train?

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[-] theKalash@feddit.ch 8 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

In that case you're actually using a limited resource: space on a train. And by occupying it you're preventing someone else from using it (assuming a full train). Copying media doesn't cost any resources (ignoring the tiny amounts of electricity) or interfere with anyone else's ability to use that resource.

They don't compare.

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[-] TehPers@beehaw.org 35 points 6 months ago

This post seems to be largely about the value of product ownership and the harm that DRM brings to the end user, and does a great job at making that point. However, the title seems to have caused a different discussion to spawn in the comments about whether piracy of digital content is justified. This is just a casual reminder to read the article before replying in the comments.

[-] PoisonedPrisonPanda@discuss.tchncs.de 9 points 6 months ago

This is just a casual reminder to read the article before replying in the comments.

This should anyway be a sticky to every post about third party content.

[-] spudwart@spudwart.com 12 points 6 months ago

If you can own nothing, then nothing is theft.

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[-] Cowbee@lemm.ee 10 points 6 months ago

IP in general is a very difficult idea to support. In theory, it's supposed to reward innovation, but in practice it results in stagnation and price gouging.

[-] satan@r.nf 9 points 6 months ago

This shit again? have people never heard of lending? the thing you get to use for a short duration at a fraction of the cost to buy it outright or create it yourself? The thing you don't actually own and have to give it back? renting?

is this some kind of alternate universe where people think they own every movie or game simply by paying $$. is this kindergarten mathematics? and this is coming from people who can't code for shit and don't realize the scale of things bts.

Get a physical copy that doesn't require internet activation then, assholes.

but but but… that requires actual physical movement and getting out of my basement. 😭

[-] 0xtero@kbin.social 52 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Get a physical copy that doesn’t require internet activation then, assholes.

I think the point was, it is increasingly hard to find such products.
And even once you think you've bought such product, DRM makes sure it's still not really yours.

[-] Safeguard@beehaw.org 37 points 6 months ago

They where using words like "purchasing", and asking just as much for the digital files as for the DVD's. If they where even available.

So it makes sense people where seeing it as "owning". And then looking puzzled when Sony decided to break into their own devices and delete files..

I have family that FINALLY see that DRM is a thing in their lives, and they DO NOT like it.

[-] 0xtero@kbin.social 26 points 6 months ago

Yeah, and as the article links, this is just not about media, CDs, DVDs and games. It's also about very physical products that we immediately associate as "owned" - like printers, phones, cars, tractors or even, (lol) trains. They're all locked to manufacturers parts and repair services and increasingly difficult to circumvent.

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[-] theKalash@feddit.ch 32 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Get a physical copy that doesn’t require internet activation then, assholes.

Just a little bit closer, you're almost getting the point!

[-] TheRtRevKaiser@beehaw.org 24 points 6 months ago

Hi @satan@r.nf, please remember Beehaw's primary founding principal when commenting here: Be(e) Nice.

It is possible to disagree with someone without using abusive language. If you think they are wrong, attack their arguments (civilly), not the person.

[-] Jamie@jamie.moe 14 points 6 months ago

Or I can pay nothing and get a plain video file that I can do anything I want with, and play on any device without needing a player. And as long as I keep that file backed up somewhere, I'll always have a copy of it.

The TV business is struggling to learn the lesson the music industry learned a long time ago.

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[-] Tau@sopuli.xyz 11 points 6 months ago

Get a physical copy that doesn't require internet activation then

I cannot speak about movies. But physical games now are also just "usage licenses", they are encrypted and if the console is connected to the internet at any momento, your rights to play the game may be revoked (just like digital games or, in this case, digital TV series)

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